Season 4 – Episode 2 – Preview

Episode – “Big Boys Don’t Cry”

Synopsis: Amaar invites Reverend Thorne to co-host an upcoming party but Thorne’s meddling threatens to turn the event into a disaster.

Airing Monday October 5th 2009 !

What will the party be for? How will Reverend Thorne meddle? How will Amaar avoid disaster?

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336 Comments

Filed under Season 4 - Episode 2

336 responses to “Season 4 – Episode 2 – Preview

  1. will rev thorne be the antagonist most of the season? his character is annoying. even fred is lovable to a degree but this guy thorne? i guess i need to finish the season because so far all i am looking forward to is ammar and rayan getting their halal boogie woogie on, lol

  2. Steve

    They said they want to give this season an “edge”.

    Which means it will probably be anti-Christian.

  3. Steve

    Here in real life they worship in an Anglican church. This seemed to pre-date the first episode of the show. I wonder if that’s how they got the concept for the show.

  4. Episode 2 has been Uploaded 🙂 enjoy all

  5. RTelier

    I have a question for you Nahida, why is it sexual harassment when Limbaugh called that girl a whore and told her she might as well put sex videos of herself online, but not when Steve tells you that you should be raped and betrayed, and keeps using rape for every political argument even though you made it clear it has a traumatic effect on you? You said two nights ago that you couldn’t even sleep, because he used it as an analogy AGAIN. He doesn’t care about the psychological impact. He doesn’t care about how SERIOUS it is, or that to tell that to a woman is basically mental torture.

    You think I’m a jackass, but even I wouldn’t do that.

  6. RTelier

    That’s actually a good question isn’t it? I bet you were afraid someone would ask that question, Nahida. Cause I don’t believe that you didn’t think of it. You’re too smart not to. You were hoping no one else would notice.

  7. Nahida

    He is sorry. And he doesn’t do it in real life.

  8. RTelier

    Really? Is he really sorry or did you just make that up? If he’s so sorry, why does he keep doing it?

  9. Nahida

    I don’t know RTelier, JUST LEAVE ME ALONE.

  10. RTelier

    So do we all get a free pass with you now?

    You know what, you should be raped. And betrayed, emphasis on the BETRAYAL.

    Come on, everyone, take a swing. Let’s see what she does.

  11. Rick

    Yeah, I hope you’re raped and betrayed too! You BITCH. Who’s stepping in now?

    That’ll teach you to disagree!

  12. Carlos

    That’s right! And if you get pregnant and have an abortion to save your life, then you’re just as bad as your rapist. And you DESERVED it!

  13. Nahida

    Please.

    RTelier, I know that is all you.

  14. RTelier

    Really, Nahida? How do you know it’s me? How do you know I’m not in fact Steve? Can you really tell the difference?

  15. RTelier

    LOL. He’s not coming for you

  16. Howard

    I hope she IS raped, then killed. And the guy who does it gets away with it! You know he would, and that’s what she gets.

  17. Garet

    It’s not sexual harassment, it’s POLITICS!

  18. RTelier

    Where’d you go, Nahida? Suddenly can’t take it can you, SLUT? Maybe you shouldn’t have been such a hypocrite and kept being nice to him after. Where is he now? He’s not going to defend you because he agrees with us using rape like this. That’s why he keeps talking like THIS. Maybe this’ll finally prove to you he was never sorry, STUPID WHORE.

    Women like you have RUINED MY LIFE.

  19. RTelier

    He won’t come for you. He won’t come for you because it means admitting what YOU didn’t have the heart to tell him, that it was sexual harassment. He’d have to throw HIMSELF under the bus to save you.How’s it feel, Nahida? How’s it feel knowing he won’t do for you what you did for him?

    MAYBE IT FEELS AS PAINFUL AS RAPE. DOES IT?

  20. Bran

    By being prochoice you’re like a RAPIST.

  21. Bran

    I hope you raped for supporting women’s rights, Nahida. And that your women’s rights friends betray you.

  22. RTelier

    Where’s the tough girl now? you still going to spare Steve’s feelings? Your loyalty is disgusting. Stupid little girl, you’re a liberal. He’s never going to risk himself for you.

    Are you reading this, BITCH? He’s still not here.

    I hope you don’t have too many plans for tomorrow, Nahida. Because it’s going to be another long, sleepless night.

  23. RTelier

    It’s not sexual harassment, so we can all say it to you. Right, Whore? I hope you’re raped and killed. It’s only political rhetoric, not sexual harassment. According to you abortionists, I can rape you because I’m stronger than you. POLITICS. That’s makes it okay for me to say it.

  24. Steve

    RTelier, now you are just being cruel.

    By the way, it was the LEFT that compared a piece of legislation to rape.

    We should all stop sexual references here. It has gone too far.

  25. RTelier

    NO. She says what Limbaugh said was sexual harassment but didn’t say it to YOU even if when you said the same type of thing. REPEATEDLY.

    NOW she needs to face it.

  26. RTelier

    IF YOU can say it I can say it. SO YOU WILL KEEP TAKING IT FROM ME NAHIDA.

  27. RTelier

    Either YOU have to admit what you said was sexual harassment. Or SHE does.

    I am TIRED of OTHER MEN getting away with this.

  28. RTelier

    You want me to stop telling you to go get raped, you BITCH, then admit it’s sexual harassment when I do. AND WHEN STEVE DOES.

    You won’t, will you. You won’t throw him under the bus. You’re pathetic.

  29. RTelier

    Go ahead, Nahida. He’s here now to hear you say it. Tell him he was sexually harassing you by definition. He kept bringing up RAPE when it made you uncomfortable. It made you cry. You lost sleep. And he did it again and again.

    He’s not admitting it. I was right. That leaves you. SAY IT, YOU HYPOCRITICAL BITCH.

    What’s it going to be? Your values, or the man who won’t even admit how bad his behavior was in order to save your integrity. Even if you did it to save his.

  30. RTelier

    If you won’t admit it you STUPID CUNT then I can KEEP TELLING YOU TO GO GET RAPED even when it disturbs you. Because apparently it’s NOT SEXUAL HARASSMENT.

    THIS is the standard you set for yourself when you kept being nice to Steve even after he kept bringing up rape again and again. With KelsShels, AND with Selina. Even when it was traumatic for you. So he wasn’t sorry, so why are you protecting him?

  31. RTelier

    By the way, it was the LEFT

    Look at him, you cunt. Your psychological health at risk, and he still talks politics instead of admitting that when he kept saying things like that to you it was sexual harassment.

    I HOPE YOUR TIGHT VIRGIN CUNT IS RIPPED APART AGAINST YOUR WILL for protecting Steve’s integrity. And your man is going to let me say it to you before he admits what he said is sexual harassment to make me stop.

  32. RTelier

    YOU’RE IN LOVE WITH HIM YOU SICK FREAK.

    He is going to watch you LOSE YOUR MIND before he stops me by admitting what he said is sexual harassment.

    • Nahida

      So let him. I would never hurt him. He isn’t hurting anyone but me.

      You know nothing of my values, RTelier.

      • Steve

        Gosh, I wish someone loved me in real life the way you do here.

      • RTelier

        Looks like he did it, Nahida. But it wasn’t for you. It was for himself.

        You remember that.

        He couldn’t read this filth. He doesn’t care that it was even harder for YOU to read it as a woman.

      • Steve

        I did it for her. I was tired of seeing you beat her up like this.

      • RTelier

        I have a hard time believing that, since you’ve done it yourself.

        But fine, the woman can believe whatever helps her. Let the feminist enjoy her one-way friendship.

      • Nahida

        I’m not a fool, RTelier.

        But I think you are. I disliked you before, but now I can only pity you. To feel insecure and unaffirmed unless your friendship is requited is human and forgivable and should be taken with compassion, even toward oneself. But to feel entitled to your friendship returned, to the point where you cannot understand the acts of others without believing they must be lying to themselves about returned friendship… that must truly feel frustratingly devoid.

        Sometimes I’m ashamed of my life, because it’s empty. But I assure you I’m not lying to myself about whether I am loved for the sake of survival.

      • RTelier

        what, so you KNOW he doesn’t care about you?

      • Nahida

        Yes. And for the record, RTelier, what you were doing was definitely sexual harassment. I suspect you knew that, as it was your intent. But for the sake of caution I’d best inform you, because if you dared try such a thing on another woman, I’d advise her to report you at once.

      • RTelier

        I feel like I should hate you but for some reason I don’t.

        Leaving now. Have fun being unloved, and knowing that you are.

      • Steve

        Nahida is very loved. Even if you don’t count me, you have to count all her friends.

  33. Steve

    Okay, if you will stop doing it I will admit it was sexual harassment.

    I wish that we could all stop talking about rape, penises, and vaginas and all of that stuff. It doesn’t belong in political debate.

    • Nahida

      Do you believe this?

      • Steve

        I guess I kind of saw his point. But of course he did it on purpose. I don’t mean to do it on purpose. Sometimes I get on “Political Mode”.

        I do care. I hope you believe that.

        I would like RTelier to explain himself a little better, like how feminists have destroyed his life.

      • Nahida

        He didn’t say feminists. He said “women like her.”

        I’ve heard him say that somewhere before.

        Even when you were referring to Kelly you said “people like her.”

        Maybe you think that’s overanalyzing, but I’ve met men like him.

        He wasn’t talking about feminism. If he were he would be convincing you the opposite of what he tried.

      • Nahida

        He attempted at least twice to claim that it’s hypocrisy I allowed to you talk to me about certain things and not him (and if he had proceeded to without my consent it would be harassment since said things were sexual in nature) as though he were entitled. (I don’t believe you were present for one of them… about bdsm.) He doesn’t believe the consent of a woman is a privilege, but a right.

        I’m guessing I ruined his life by telling him it isn’t. And now he is destined to solitude because for whatever reason he cannot comprehend, women aren’t falling over themselves at his sense of entitlement, and if he persists to pursue them it’s sexual harassment. (In case you don’t believe me: http://manboobz.blogspot.com/2010/11/consent-its-so-american.html) In your absence, he even attacked American women, because supposedly we’re so arrogant we think we’re too good for men. (I guess that must be why American women never date men EVER. Of course by “women” he means “attractive women” and by “men” he means himself.)

        That’s why he wanted me to say it to you. He was looking for a different kind of “justice.”

        I would never say something like that to you, especially in that circumstance. That’s two folds of treachery. Or three. It has a number of layers. And of course I know you didn’t mean it on purpose. So I never saw any reason;–you would never persist to do it in real life to someone else, and so it would just shock and hurt you without any constructive or preventative cause. And I promised you I would never deliberately shock or hurt you. What a terrible betrayal, to say something like that, and in a situation someone SET UP of all circumstances! Save myself by attacking your integrity and betraying your trust? I was so insulted he thought I would!

        *kiss* good night.

      • RTelier

        HYPOCRITE!

      • Nahida

        …Ugh, what now RTelier?

        I swear, you’re like a screaming child.

        I thought you said you left? Why are you lurking, you creepo…

      • RTelier

        *kiss* good night.

        I don’t believe he CONSENTED.

        In real life he can dodge you, but you forced him to read that without warning. And don’t say you did it before and he didn’t say anything (yeah, I noticed!) because feminists say NO UNTIL YES. And don’t tell me you do it to women, because even if you do it to women the only man you’ve done it to is Steve which MAKES IT SPECIFIC.

      • Nahida

        *rolls eyes* Very well. Steve, I’m sorry I’ve assaulted you. (On the Internet. Which is possible, apparently. Even though I’ve never heard any feminist make this claim, ever. Harassment on the Internet, but not assault. Seriously, RTelier, you suck at pointing out hypocrisy.) By all means I will cease typing that ever again until you dispense your permission.

      • RTelier

        …what so if a man said that to you, that WOULDN’t be harassment?

      • Nahida

        Not unless he is doing to to be aggressive, show dominance, otherwise employ a tactic of intimidation, or proceeds to do it after I’ve made it clear it is unwelcome.

        REALLY? We’ve been over this here. A million times. A million times. Several women here (some of whom don’t even identify as feminists) have informed me that they’ve repeated it. I even reflected on the criteria in my email to Olivia, which she posted here. Are you seriously that dense as for all of it to swing over your head? I don’t have the patience for this; I’m tired of clarifying things for you because you’re stuck on some version of the strawfeminist that you’ve constructed for your convenience, seeing that you’re incapable of differentiating hypocrisy from nuance. Hypocrisy! Nuance! Look up the difference! So tiresome; I almost want to create a feminist theory in which being stupid is harassment.*

        *This is a joke. Don’t freak out on some other poor feminist insisting that it’s a real theory.

      • RTelier

        So by definition Steve was sexually harassing you then, because you told him to stop and he even APOLOGIZED yet he kept doing it when it was unwelcome.

        You’re much more patient with Steve. It’s not fair. Even when he said that it seems to only be sexual harassment when the man is attractive you explained it to him patiently. That’s bullshit, by the way, I think all men should be treated the same.

      • Nahida

        And that’s why you’re an idiot. That’s easy statement, but it’s meaningless. You’re just saying that to sound like anyone who disagrees with you is a bigot. All men should not be treated the same. If you tell a woman she is pretty, and she doesn’t mind and you continue, that is not the same as when a different man tells her the same thing and she asks him to stop or walks away from him while he continues to talk to her like that. It doesn’t matter why she rejected one and was receptive to the other. It matters that she refused and he persisted, disrespecting her boundaries and beginning to scare and frustrate her. She does not owe you an explanation. It is the same with men pursued by women. You are not entitled to her acceptance, and she is not entitled to yours. It doesn’t matter the attractiveness of the man, but the presence of consent. That is what makes it harassment or not. Because unlike what men believe, the world doesn’t revolve around them and whether or not they’re attractive!

        Yes, I was patient with Steve. It was a gift! I don’t OWE you my patience, RTelier. I don’t owe you anything! I’m even typing this grudgingly. And that’s all I’m going to explain to you. This is horrendously boring for me.

      • RTelier

        But what if the reason she doesn’t give consent is because he’s unattractive?

      • Nahida

        …Dear. God.

        I’m going to bed.

      • Nahida

        One last comment, RTelier, because despite your disgusting display today (yesterday? it’s after midnight) I’ve developed some strange sort of piteous sympathy for you. You are holding feminism accountable for a problem it was never designed to solve: your relationship status. Feminism didn’t ruin your life. Your entitlement did. (I’m guessing it’s your entitlement. Because good God what a turn-off.) You’re not actually dense; you just can’t get past the idea that you’re owed something. And seriously? You think your life is ruined just because women won’t let you hit on them? And the fact that you think feminism was designed for your relationship status instead of, you know, liberating women exactly from entitled men like you? Beyond conceited.

        Feminism isn’t a dating solution; it’s an ideology. And a 24/7 lifestyle, as you’ve demonstrated by making it your mission to police me constantly. (Really, I’m doing fine policing myself–gtfo you’re worse than the haraam police.) Please stop looking for a scapegoat, and sort out your issues.

  34. RTelier

    But IS because of feminism.

  35. RTelier

    Feminism made women conceited. They think they can have everything. They don’t think about anyone else or the men they’re hurting.

  36. RTelier

    So they have these impossible standards for the kind of men they want that men can’t achieve because they think they can do everything now.

    Why are you patient with Steve, anyway? It’s aways the WRONG guy.

  37. RTelier

    Do you think he just got here and read all that at once, Nahida? You probably think he did. But maybe he was reading along the whole time, and he just amused himself and let it go on for a little bit first. He didn’t say he couldn’t stand it or anything, he just said he got “tired” of it.

    You think he understands how much it disturbs you, but he doesn’t. For one, he’s a man, so he’s using tactics that he will never even face on a daily basis. But I don’t need to tell you that, it’s the first thing feminists know. On top of that, he’s lost sensitivity. And you’re a liberal.

    • Steve

      I don’t come here all the time. I do have a life and I was working when you started it. As soon as I saw it, I responded.

      In a strange way I do sympathize with you RTelier but you have gone over an edge.

  38. RTelier

    You called out for him once. Way in the beginning, already. And then you stayed quiet after that. That would have broken a normal man’s heart.

    You know what? I hate you again, Nahida. You deserve everything he says! That’s for letting him talk to you like that. I guess you’re fine with it after all.

    • Nahida

      I didn’t call out for him to rescue me. It was in a flurry of agony and because you mentioned him at that moment, asking if I could tell the difference. I was disconcerted and panicked for a minute because I couldn’t. It did good anyway to remind me of the value in tolerating you for the importance of loyalty.

      Do you think this is a game, RTelier? I am angry with you now. I didn’t have the room for anger before (we have a threshold for how much we can feel and with devotion prioritized and pain immediate I had no nerves to spare for anger). I actually feel sick. Psychologically, and physically weakened. I will have to recover. And I will have to continue recovering from gratuitous, impulsive attacks from men like you for the rest of my life. What did you think would happen you fool, when you attempted to counter my feminist values with Steve and demanded I make a choice that never existed? Devotion is a powerful feminist act. The ideology is built on solidarity regardless of how violently members disagree with each other. And on not entitling oneself to the graces of others. Steve thinks I’m the person I am despite my politics, but it’s really because of them. I chose them for a reason. Maybe I’ve customized them, but that’s true for everyone, and what you overlooked were the most basic consistent principles. And you know nothing of my values to speak of them.

      Who says I wouldn’t want her now?

      Because I’m “damaged merchandise,” Steve. That’s how this is meant to work. Sexual harassment (and assault and rape) results in character defamation, intense slut-shaming, and consequentially rendering women undesirable in a society in which their worth is defined by men. Her appearance is his status… and so is her defilement, whether real or imaginary. Mob slut-shaming will follow, and victims will perpetually place themselves in dangerous situations out of confusion and in attempt to reclaim their autonomy, believing if anyone tried again this time they can stop it and feel restored again. He knew exactly what he was doing. It’s an age-old tactic. And he wins in every way. As he pictured it, even if you don’t say what he wants you to say (he wanted you to admit it because, with the same behavior, he’s been accused of it and he thinks it’s unfair and a flaw in feminist theory) and even if you let him continue, ultimately you don’t want me, my confidence has been taken down a notch or three (sweet, since I represent every woman who’s ever taken down his by practicing her right to reject him), and he gleefully feels there is justice for his rejection because I will now receive the same. It’s justice either way.

      I’m going to go for a while now.

      I’m leaving now (for real). You can’t say anything back.

      RTelier, you’re a manchild. I’m angry with you; I don’t even know how this is making me laugh, with affection of all things, but it is. Happy flouncing.

      • John

        Your first paragraph makes me so sad.

      • John

        And this part.

        What did you think would happen you fool, when you attempted to counter my feminist values with Steve and demanded I make a choice that never existed? Devotion is a powerful feminist act. The ideology is built on solidarity regardless of how violently members disagree with each other. And on not entitling oneself to the graces of others. Steve thinks I’m the person I am despite my politics, but it’s really because of them. I chose them for a reason. Maybe I’ve customized them, but that’s true for everyone, and what you overlooked were the most basic consistent principles.

        I find this fascinating… i remember Nahida saying somewhere that feminism is a component of her religion, and from what I know about religious feminists that’s how most of them feel. That really sounds spiritual doesn’t it? What does everyone think of this? I wish she could explain it more, maybe she can when she recovers and comes back. I feel like that’s the “idealized” version of feminism that’s rarely executed… or at least i’ve never seen it. Steve you ever seen this side before?

        I don’t feel like it’s NEW because it sounds familiar, but I wonder where it came from.

      • Steve

        I admit sometimes it does seem confusing and like there’s some type of double standard involved. Even at my age I have yet to fully reconcile it.

        It would be best if such stuff is left out of conversations completely.

        It is too bad that male and females must consider each other enemies.

  39. Nahida

    Shockingly, RTelier, preventing you from hating me is not even near the top of my list of priorities or concerns. Please stay out of my imaginary one-way friendships and mind your own.

    I have also just decided to stop speaking to you, which is what I should have decided the very day you first arrived exhibiting concern for an article on the rise of cunnilingus. (Unsolicited real-life dating advice: that’s a terrible opener.)

  40. RTelier

    Well good because I’m going to keep hating you!

    How can you love someone more than they love you? He would never speak to you in real life, even if he thinks you’re beautiful, because you’re a liberal. He probably wouldn’t even think you’re beautiful because you’re a liberal. He wouldn’t want anything to do with you, and he definitely doesn’t want you now, because I completely defamed your character yesterday. So I guess I’m the one with the last word.

    That’s all I have to say. I’m leaving now (for real). You can’t say anything back. See ya!

    • Steve

      Who says I wouldn’t want her now?

    • Steve

      I probably wouldn’t know her in real life. Of course I would think she was beautiful. Regarding would I want anything to do with her it would be totally based on the context on how I knew her. If I knew her away from politics and saw how kind she really is, certainly I would want to talk to her.

  41. Chris

    I can’t believe this happened while I was away for a day at a conference. I would have defended her.

    RTelier is a repulsive person. He needs to deflate his damn ego. There are many reasons to criticize feminism, but giving women the right to reject men and then protect themselves if the men don’t stop isn’t one of them.

    (he wanted you to admit it because, with the same behavior, he’s been accused of it and he thinks it’s unfair and a flaw in feminist theory)

    That’s what he thinks but he’s wrong. Nahida knows this already, I’m just saying in case this dude is still around. Nahida letting Steve go and other women NOT letting RTelier go, isn’t because of “a flaw in feminist theory” It’s because of each individual woman’s own decision. No one should be saying things like that in the first place, so the other women gave RTelier what he deserved whereas Nahida showed kindness. But she didn’t have to. RTelier isn’t OWED a pass, and just because he didn’t get one doesn’t mean he can interfere with Nahida’s decision for Steve. Especially not by attacking her like that. WTF. Imagine that with other crimes. You can’t steal from someone’s house, get arrested, and then hear about another person who was robbed letting someone go and forgiving them, and then shaming that person for not “delivering” the same justice you got. People see this as a double standard, but it’s not. And feminists have a point when they say if it was any other crime no one would be as confused. They only are because men like RTelier are assholes and like Nahida said they think they’re entitled to everything.

    That’s really how this all works. I mean, look what happened when Nahida forgave Steve even when she knew the extent of what he said. RTelier started to do the same thing and demand the same forgiveness. What Nahida told Steve what happened when he asked why wouldn’t he want her now, is exactly what happened. Nahida was targetted as a “slut.”

    And if this was all in public? She would unfairly be called a hypocrite.

    Really makes you wonder.

    Like I said, I have all sorts of issues with feminism. I want to ask Nahida, but I won’t for my own reasons. Anyway, I’m starting to doubt the issues now.

    • RTelier

      Oh, come on. Sure I saw it as justice but I was also worried about what she was letting herself go through by still being nice to Steve. Didn’t anyone notice THAT? This way she’ll know.

      • Nahida

        Oh I suppose you were just protecting me too were you? It all came from a place of concern!

        Just like Steve when he said those things to me, and then when he tormented me persistently about that girl committing suicide. When all I said is that the sign was wrong. How dare I? I needed to be taught a valuable life lesson! The irony was lost on him of course.

        Fuck you, RTelier. Who the hell do you think you are to teach me anything?

        But go ahead. Tell me that being loved feels like being punched in the stomach–and then say that I deserve it when I mistake a man’s abuse for his concern!

      • RTelier

        I’m exactly like Steve. I even notice more than him. About you, I mean. But you’re kinder to him.

        It won’t even make a difference to him, what I did. He says he respects women, but how does he treat you? No matter how much he knows about you, or sees happening. He’ll still call women whores and sluts, he’ll still contribute to destroying their lives, and he won’t even know. Remember he said you had “no right to get so angry at Limbaugh”? Even if that girl was talking about ovarian cysts, wasn’t even talking about her sex life and Limbaugh totally made it up when he called her a whore. Do you think he understands any better because now he’s seen me do it to you? He doesn’t give a damn, doesn’t care about you, and you know that. All he cares is that you want him to pay for your birth control, and you’re a whore too.

        He’s right. I don’t want to pay for her birth control either. But I get it, and he doesn’t.

      • Nahida

        You are nothing like Steve. You don’t even know him. And he’s sorry for all the other things he said.

      • RTelier

        And you know him, little girl?

        Oh really? He’s sorry for everything else too? When did he say that? Or did you just make it up. Is that what he told you in your mind, Nahida? Did he look you in the eye and apologize for absolutely everything before you kissed him? Even if he said it in reality, you saw how much his apology is worth.

        You used to hate it whenever he brought up your age. (Oh yes I was here then too. Left for a couple of years and came back.) He thought it was because you weren’t wise enough to know there’s a difference, but it was really because you knew he was talking down to you. He kept using it as a trump card to his advantage. You were 15, and you knew adults. You were trying to tell him sometimes it matters, but most times it was just something they used just because they had the power, but he wasn’t getting it. It was… what do you feminists call it, “ageist.” You didn’t use that word though, he would have made fun of you. Lightly, like he did when he made fun of your grammar policing. He was kind to you back then. You were just a kid. How cute, he would have said, did you make that up?

        All you ever wanted was for him to see you as his equal. Not below him or above him, just level. And then one day he stopped. He still mentioned your age, but now he even downplayed his own. He said he still considered himself young. He said he was still young enough to need history books. Because now he saw you as greater than his equal.

        Oh man, and did that drive you insane. You went from below to above, right past the middle where you wanted to be. You cussed hard. You tried to be crude with him, but couldn’t do it because it would make him uncomfortable, and that’s against your feminist ideology. That’s why none of the women here were able to match him. They couldn’t even if they wanted to, for them it would be hypocritical.

        You’re right, I’m nothing like Steve. He’s a better man. I would have taken advantage of you. Not in the sense he did, by seeking comfort from you while not knowing how to give, but I mean I would have done it in a different sense. That’s the thing about snowflakes, they give without wanting to receive, and they give completely, they’re so easy to abuse. You’re probably way too smart to fall for it, but I would have tried.

        You freaked out a little just now when he said “even at his age” he can’t reconcile, because you wonder if my little act worked, Nahida… if he really thinks less of you, that you’re unworthy of him, because the things I said to you. Even if he doesn’t admit it out loud. Slut Shaming works wonders don’t it.

      • Nahida

        You’re a FREAK, RTelier. I am not an open novel for your interpretation and entertainment. And neither is he. You have no idea what he was thinking. You don’t know him. Maybe you can say I don’t, but I know him better than you!

        Steve knows how to give, just not how to be taken. Stop confusing him with yourself.

        I am not going to enable you. None of this is any of your business.

      • RTelier

        Look at you, always so protective of the things you consider holy. But you ruined my life, and this is deserved.

        My work here is done. I’ve made Steve straighten out your hypocrisy and admit what he did was sexual harassment. Even if people say you’re not a hypocrite for being nice to him still and even if they say I just don’t understand, I know women like you are so arrogant. You treat attractive men better, we need to be treated the same. And I took you down for it. You are “damaged merchandise” Nahida. A little something I learned. That’s how he sees you now. So long.

      • RTelier

        Of course, I didn’t even have to do much because he’s done so much himself. That affected you even more than what I did because you don’t care about me enough for me to really hurt you. It disturbed you more that Steve saw what I said than the fact I was actually saying it.

        He can heal you. But he doesn’t know how. You do, all he has to do is secure you again, but you’re too respectful of his boundaries to ask him. You’ll take the long hard way and heal by yourself.

        I know people like you. Your love is so pure it’s deadly. And you deserve the pain for giving it to the wrong people.

      • Chris

        Dude. You keep saying you’re leaving but then you never leave. Go away for another few years. Haven’t you done enough?

      • Steve

        Nahida, my name isn’t Steve. Does that destroy your “love” for me?

      • Nahida

        No.

        I’m deceptive, manipulative, clingy, and I can’t distinguish reality from fantasy. Also I tell small children that I turn into a mermaid every night. And that Santa Claus isn’t real. Okay, I don’t tell them that, but the former mermaid thing is true.

      • Chris

        No matter how much I know about you, you still seem mysterious.

  42. Chris

    Geez, Nahida, why does everyone have a problem with you?!

    • Nahida

      I don’t know

      • Chris

        It’s like people have a problem with the fact that you exist.

      • Nahida

        I do know. RTelier believes feminism is only good if it gets him laid. And he’s too thick to see who has the upper hand still. He got exactly what he wanted. It was fixed so that he would whether or not Steve said anything. Since he did, RTelier was able to confiscate my right to decide to apply justice or mercy according to my preference. If he hadn’t, RTelier would continue to successfully get away with sexually harassing me. And both ways he executed character defamation. He’d have won no matter what happened. Why does he think that is?

        And there was nothing I could have said to him that would be equally damaging… except to accuse him of sexual harassment. It would have destroyed his character the same way. Feminism leveled the playing field, and that’s what his issue is.

        There are no double standards that privilege women. When you are a proud member of the sex that has been dominant since the beginning of time and occasionally you find yourself NOT on the top–because, let’s say, you’re unattractive–that is not oppression, it is BACKFIRING. Because you set the standard for conventional attractiveness for both men and women. When you say that attractive men are physically strong, or stoic, or violent and you happen to be none of those things, that is a fault of the patriarchal system you set up yourself, not feminism. You’ve screwed yourself over with your own damn system. Feminism is meant to achieve equality by liberating women, not men. Liberate your own damn selves. If I can find men attractive whom the patriarchy deems unattractive, and you can’t do the same with women and instead insist on wanting conventionally attractive women–well, you want to have your cake and eat it to. Which is very interesting, because that’s what you accuse feminists of doing.

        There are no double standards that privilege women. Men die at war because THAT’S how YOU made it. They commit suicide because they failed to achieve the rigorous standards of masculinity that YOU established. They get their kids taken away in divorce because YOU don’t value nurturing parenting skills in men and they end up abusive. They pay alimony, because YOU promote the idea that men have to work. And they fair poorly in school because YOU hate femininity so much, that once women integrate themselves into “male territories” like the classroom it immediately becomes uncool. This happens in every area. Men used to dominant literature, music, and poetry, until they had competition and they were too disgusted to even try… and so they labeled those areas as “inferior.” And at the professional level? They STILL dominate those areas. And the system STILL disadvantages women. Seriously, every author I read in high school in English class was MALE. Except The Awakening which is a TERRIBLE book. Don’t give me bullshit about how boys aren’t interested the classroom has evolved to cater to the learning styles of girls. Boys and girls do not learn differently: all individuals learn differently regardless of their sex. There are both lectures and labs in science courses, roughhousing may not be allowed in the classroom but it is allowed in the grass on the field, and as I said practically EVERY “great American” novel we read in English was written by a MAN. What the hell more do you want? You know what the problem is? You SUCK at raising boys. You set impossible standards for masculinity, and you’re just bitter that feminists have had the audacity to try and free themselves from their assigned roles while the system you created yourself is forcing you to stay in yours.

        I’m so sick of fire and ice. I have to do everything. EVERYTHING. Men complain that when they’re abused by women and they call a shelter, the woman who answers the phone assumes they are the abuser. Well that sucks–but that’s because YOUR patriarchy promotes male violence. You want women to stop assuming you’re rapists and murderers? Stop raping and killing. Most women NEVER support sexual harassment. And when they do? It fucking serves you right. And when there’s a false allegation (0.2% of the time) there is outrage and it explodes into national news the way other crimes never will. Supposedly because an innocent man’s life has been ruined. Your life is not ruined because of feminism, it is ruined because YOUR system SIMULTANEOUSLY promotes life-destroying violence like rape through male culture and severe justice for criminals who don’t treat women as preciously dainty. But only the right women. The right victims. Not women who sleep around, not prostitutes (shoplifting! not rape, amirite?), the women who comply with patriarchy. Delicate women in pretty white dresses who don’t drink or fight or anything else that’s only allowed for enjoyment by men and instead just HAPPEN to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. Well here’s the reality: every fucking woman is always in the wrong place at the wrong time. There is nothing you can do to prevent rape. Except stop raping.

        Chris Brown punched Rhianna in the face and the joke was on her. Can you IMAGINE if he had done that to Taylor Swift? Taylor Swift, perpetually virginal, white, singing about fairytales instead of cheating and bdsm.

        RTelier, liberate your own damn self. Whether or not you can get laid is the LEAST of my problems. You are reactionary. But don’t worry, you’re still the first sex. The fact that you can’t sexually harass women anymore is not unearned oppression, it is a loss of UNDESERVED privilege. Don’t worry though, you still have a ton of it left.

      • Nahida

        Can I have your birthday Steve?

        I’m not going to do anything with it. In case you’re wondering why I would ask something so bizarrely random. I’m just overly sentimental.

        RTelier is lying about me. My love isn’t pure. (Sometimes I doubt it even exists.) I wish you knew what a crazy manipulative bitch I am. With the good and the bad you would finally see me as of equal worth. And not at all a snowflake.

      • Steve

        This simple request have kept me up tonight. I must be one of the most suspicious people on the planet. I mean it’s such a simple request and on the surface level I can’t imagine what the harm could be.

        Heck, I could lie, Nahida, wouldn’t know any different. I lie about my name so why not? Is it because I feel that our relationship has progressed to such a level I would feel guilty deceiving her like that, even if it is for her own good?

        So why not just give her my real birthday? What harm would that do. Damn I must be a terrible person to not even trust someone as beautiful minded as Nahida, some one who I honestly feel honored to have even this level of contact with. What I have learned from her even within the last week I am still trying to process.

        You know, I actually wondered if Nahida was RTeiler? Can you imagine that? That is how suspiciously minded I am.

        Nahida, I don’t know why, but something within me compels me not to comply to your request. It’s not to hurt you, at least I think it isn’t. I can’t really give an answer to why I can’t. I am going to be obsessing on this for days if not months. It’s not you, it really is me. I really don’t understand why I can’t give you something so small. I have come to love you and I find that so strange that something like that can happen in an Internet blog forum.

        I will with you put politics aside and try not to hurt you. I don’t want to hurt you. I want to view you as a real person. You know I wouldn’t be hurting you if we knew each other face to face. Well, perhaps I would if I saw you as a political adversary but I no longer see you primarily as that anymore.

        I wonder if part of this is how our different generations relate to the Internet. I mean for you the Internet has always been. Heck, I didn’t know about email until I reached college, because back then it was indeed just limited to like University systems that would communicate with each other. The internet as we have it today didn’t even begin until I was like a couple of years older than you are now.

        You treat the internet and the people in the internet as something real, which of course it really is. I guess I have always used the internet to hide. To me the internet was a way of saying things that I would never dare say in public. It is still that way with me,

        You said ” you are not an open novel for your interpretation and entertainment. ” But isn’t that what you made yourself with how open and honest you have made yourself with your blog and your comments here? I could never imagine being so exposed as you have allowed yourself to be without a pseudonym. It literally scares me even the thought.

        Again, please accept my apology for not giving in to this very simple request of yours. I am sure it’s because I am a terrible person but beyond that, the reasons for this allude me. I am sure it will keep me up thinking about it.

      • Steve

        One of the reasons I have always used a pseudonym is that I have always thought that it should be the ideas that matter, and not the people behind them. I thought the ideas stand alone.

        Also because, yeah I saw it a game, but then with you Nahida it turned into something else, and I am still unsure quite what it turned into.

      • Steve

        Give me a few days to think about it. I don’t know why I am seeing this as such a tough request.

        If I do, I will email it to you privately.

      • Nahida

        You don’t have to give it to me.

        It occurred to me a couple of times that Steve isn’t your real name, and the idea made me feel like a bit of a fool. Kelly, who withheld her judgment, had said nothing with the discovery but Lily–who does not always register when it’s inappropriate–blurted out, “Do you even know his last name?!” Well apparently, I don’t know his first. (Gosh, I had thought, what if I don’t know his first?!) And I thought that was unlikely (because no one is that protective right?) and also the initials you sometimes used after it seemed consistent, or maybe you just randomly looked down at your keyboard and chose J and H. They are right next to each other. But not in that order… are you left-handed?

        But when you told me it wasn’t your real name, I didn’t feel any loss. I just tossed it. That was surprising… I guess I don’t become attached to names. (I thought I did, because when I make up characters for writing stories I can’t just decide to change their names if I’ve written in too deep… unless the new one really, really fits.) It was probably just the unacceptability that bothered me. It’s not viewed as okay to become attached to someone and not know his name. My friends are all VERY nonjudgmental, but I wonder how many of them thought it, if only for safety. I would have. I did notice Debbie shrugging off, “She’s a smart girl,” when she was over here, as though it were to assure herself that I wouldn’t do anything inconceivably stupid. And I wasn’t worried myself, because I couldn’t do anything inconceivably stupid even if I wanted to. You made it that way.

        In fact, a part of me was frightened that if you gave me your real contact information I would actually do something inconceivably stupid. (Frontal lobe of the brain doesn’t develop until age 25, after all!) I have a feeling every single one of them was just trailing behind me while I was here just to make sure nothing happened… because while we see the Internet and everyone on it as real, it isn’t so large as to have your friends on the same place at once and hang out. (Even if they’re you’re roommates!) They were deliberately watching out. They’re not nearly as suspicious of women. (Of course on the Internet you can’t tell if someone who presents herself as female is actually female. But yeah, we do tend to take people’s word on that. If anyone tells me through my blog that they’re female, I find it incredibly easy to tell when they’re lying, simply because of what the blog is about. It’s pretty difficult to fake.)

        You are right to be suspicious, and it is not because you are a terrible person. People have destroyed their own lives through the Internet. And you were right to wonder if I were RTelier. I am sure I can do something that deceptive. I’d probably feel unbelievably, intolerably guilty, but I know I could do it if I were pushed far enough. If I did, I wonder if I would be able to tell you after, or if I’d be too ashamed. Either way you should know right now I am capable of doing it. How long I could live with… now that’s only a matter of justification. Be suspicious of everything! It would be an unspeakable sin to deceive you, exactly since you are so careful.

        I treat the Internet as real because I must, for my own safety. I receive rape threats every day. So far I’ve dismiss them all, but I have to continuously scan stats to see if they’re new or returning. If they’re returning consistently I need to go to the police with the IP address, get a report for harassment, call the Internet provider who owns the IP address, fax them the police report, and they are then obligated to give me their clients full name. And then court. It’s so much of a hassle; I hope it never happens. I’m too small for that, but I’ve seen cases of mass attacks (dozens of men at once from different locations) to take down major mainstream feminist sites. Luckily the women are always tech savvy!

        Even despite that element, everyone is real to me. In fact, the more imaginary they are, the more real they are, unless I make them up myself. It is a terrible curse. I used to cry when I was younger at the thought that the characters in the books to whom I’d grown so attached weren’t real. Really cry. Anne Shirley was my best childhood friend.

        I never had an imaginary friend though, even thought I tried really hard. Isn’t that weird? I would think I’d be that kind of kid. But no, I wasn’t even though I tried. For the longest time I was depressed that this meant my imagination is inadequate. But I’m glad. I’m sure my inability prevented heartbreak.

      • Nahida

        OH! Oh, Steve, I just remembered something I’ve been meaning to tell you EVER since I first realized you had gotten the wrong idea. I kept forgetting, because I have the wrong idea too!

        I wasn’t born in this country. I arrived when I was 2 years old.

        When I first told you… well actually I never told you I was born here; I only implied it accidentally. I said, “I’ve lived here my whole life. That’s 15 years now.” You took this to mean I was born here. I guess I hadn’t lived here my whole life, just 13 of the 15 years. I hadn’t realized you thought I was born here until you told Debbie, “She was born one of us.” I’m sure you said something like that before, but I never caught it until then because I’m perpetually under the same impression, and whenever I read something close to the implication that I was born here it never occurs to me that it’s factually incorrect. Even though I know the fact, it’s always something I forget. Sometimes I even start to fill out forms that ask for my location of birth, and I begin to write my hometown in California–in pen!–before I realize it’s wrong and have to cross it out. And then I get really heartbroken and annoyed, because why do they even care? I’m really sorry, I honestly didn’t mean to lie about this. As far as I’m concerned, I was born here. This is the only place I’ve ever known as home. I can’t imagine being a citizen of anywhere else or calling it home like here. Sometimes I even have memories of before I was two, of my grandmother and the house she lives in, but that house in my mind is always in California. Even though I know it isn’t in reality. Even the field surrounding the house is in California. The cows are Californian. The servants. There is a memory I have of a particular one of the servants (my mother retells the story) bringing back a very large fish from the pond. It was enormous. I was eleven months. “Fish!” I exclaimed. “Fish fish fish!”

        “That’s not fish, little mistress,” he corrected in his–their–language, believing I was only baby talking, not speaking English. And then he used the native word. My grandfather informed him kindly that I was actually in fact speaking “another” language. “He loved you like a father,” my mother said of the servant. “More than yours ever did. I wish I could tell you his name, but he didn’t work for us. He worked for him. And he wouldn’t speak or look at him for days every time he hurt you.”

        I wish he hadn’t worked for him. I wish none had worked for him. My mother’s family treated them right; they ate dinner at the table with us, worked reasonable hours, were given advances if possible at request. My mother’s family only had one or two at a time (usually one), because they were also rather poor themselves. But not his. He was extremely wealthy, all of them on that side, and the horror stories of abuse will make your stomach queasy.

        I vowed at a very young age I would never hire a maid (even if it’s different here, I still don’t register… because there is–well, there is here!) Some of them had been children. Children! I played with them. Only when I was with my mother’s family. Otherwise they weren’t allowed.

        And as far as I’m concerned, the man who corrected my proclamations of “fish!” was Californian too. Everything is in California; I have to actively correct my memory to retrieve the truth. I know that seems preposterous, because typing it all out now, it doesn’t sound remotely like California. But I always forget I wasn’t born here. There simply is no other place for me. I’m not even telling you the name, because it just doesn’t matter. When people ask, I tell them I’m from here, and even when they cross-examine me (like all racial minorities) it doesn’t even occur to me that there is a different “correct” answer.

        When I told you I lived here my whole life, I truly believed it. And I am very, very sorry.

      • Nahida

        (Don’t read this one first or it won’t make sense; scroll up two comments and start from the beginning in the order I wrote them.)

        Is it because I feel that our relationship has progressed to such a level I would feel guilty deceiving her like that, even if it is for her own good?

        For my own good? But if you’re suspicious isn’t it for your own preservations?

        You’re not a terrible person. You have every reason: look what I’ve done already! I wish I could go back six years and edit my own words so as not to give you the wrong impression. Out of all the factual information you know–my appearance, religion, birth day, number of siblings, first name, weight (although I did gain 4 pounds so now I’m 97 pounds), waist circumference… you even know my bra size from that post (good God I do share everything, now that I see it listed like this)–the location of my birth must have been the most important to you, the foundation of all other facts. And of all the basic facts it’s the one I had to mess up. I don’t know what would be significant enough to make up for this. Did you know I hate bananas? I probably hate bananas to same intensity as your disgust right now. I don’t understand people who don’t hate bananas. I can never be friends with them. (Unless you don’t hate bananas, in which case I am willing to make an exception.)

      • Steve@steve.com

        I meant that lying about my Birthday would be “for your own good” because it would accomplish what you wanted while preserving whatever I am trying to preserve.

      • Steve

        Nahida, I kind of don’t feel you lied about your birthplace even though technically you didn’t tell me the facts. You told me the “Essential Truth” and that is that in your heart and soul you are completely and only an American. The fact that you still don’t name the actual country of your birth indicates that to me.

        Whenever we have a conversation I can tell that I am indeed talking to “an American” (do you have US citizenship, I guess you do). I don’t get that feeling with Obama (even if he was indeed born in Hawaii) and to be fair I don’t get that feeling with Rubio either.

        I have to admit immigrants concern me. It is just too easy to remain connected to the “old country” these days. Immigrants of the past had to totally forsake their old land to come to America. And the long boat trip was kind of a “Separating Experience” as well. No these people came to stay and make America their home.

        But you were a great addition to the American family. I have no concern about “dual loyalty” when it comes to you. That is why I guess I don’t feel deceived. Like you said, you feel American, America is the home you know. It doesn’t sound like you could “go back to where you came from” as you just would feel like an alien, a foreigner in that society, whatever that society is.

      • Chris

        and chose J and H. They are right next to each other. But not in that order… are you left-handed?

        Sharper than a knife. Who thinks of that?

        So, Nahida, how did you know the word for fish anyway? Is English your first language?

      • Nahida

        Of course I have citizenship.

        Chris, my grandfather was very well-educated. Brilliant, in fact. He was a math professor. He taught me a few words in English (which he spoke very well.) My mother’s whole family was really studious. She was getting her Bachelor’s in philosophy before she married and ruined her life. No, English wasn’t my first language. But it’s the one I know best. That always confused me when I was young because in kindergarten teachers would ask, “Is English your first language?” and I would reply that no it isn’t, and they would hand me (and a few of other students) a slightly different worksheet than everyone else, with pictures along with the words.

        And I’d be like, “…Um. I don’t need this.”

        I didn’t understand why they asked the question like that if what they wanted was whether I was efficient in English. I spoke it better than the other students! They must have realized at some point because I noticed years later on surveys instead of “What is your first language?” it asks “Which language do you understand best?” Much more effective.

        I guess I pick up language really fast. My mother never spoke to me in English and was amazed that I was fluent. She didn’t even find out until she enrolled me in kindergarten, and she couldn’t for the life of her figure out how I learned it when I was never even allowed to play with children outside. The lady who tested me during enrollment initially asked my mother, “Does she speak English?” and my mother replied, “No.” And then I proceeded to tell them both a story about a dragon and a mouse who lived together in a castle and ended up best friends, in perfect English, while they sat there stunned. I told them that there were cloud people who lived in the clouds, and they are very quiet and easily scared, so that’s why no one knows they exist because airplanes are so loud and they always hide, frightened. Not sure where I got that absurd idea–I must have read it somewhere.

        Steve, well I’d rather you not give me any at all than a fake one, so if you decide not to, I won’t be hurt or anything. I understand.

      • Nahida

        It is too bad that male and females must consider each other enemies.

        Well you see Steve, God created man, and, finding him not lonely enough, gave him a companion, so that he may more sharply feel the searing pain of his desolation.

      • RTelier

        I just have one more question. It’s driving me crazy. WHAT does a woman like YOU find so attractive about him?

      • Nahida

        *snort* Why don’t you tell me, RTelier, since you obviously know me so well?

        I know men like you too. You’re such a Nice Guy (TM). That’s what feminists like me call you. Nice Guys. I have written about you. Perpetually broody, entitled, manipulating women by attempting to guilt us with speeches about what a nice guy you are and we never give nice guys a chance, you believe that you only act like an asshole because women like assholes. But in reality, you act like an asshole because you really are an asshole, and you just needed an excuse. In fact, I bet you think that’s what’s so attractive about him. Even though you’re wrong. Because that’s what you do; you tell women the men they’re attracted to are assholes as though you know! Yeah that’s what a woman really wants to hear–her man insulted by some random prick. You think you’re standing up for your sex; you’re only compartmentalizing and judging them. A feminist–someone who is truly concerned with the rights of her sex–would never tell a man he’s better than his woman at a single glance. Unless the woman like, punched him in the face in that single glance. People act up in relationships. Relationships are sanctuaries; while ideally you would be respectful at all times, you can throw an occasional tantrum and trust you won’t be left. An outsider has no idea from seeing just that. You don’t know how they are in private. A feminist would approach the woman herself. “You know, that was really douchey of you. Why’d you do that to him?” Because she has a genuine interest in the safety of that man. But you? You don’t approach the man because your interest is not for the safety of the woman but selfishly for the woman herself; you approach the woman because you want her. “Leave him! Take me instead!” You tell her you’re not an asshole like him, but of course you are.

        I’m sorry, RTelier, but I would need his CONSENT to answer that. Aren’t you suddenly huge on that now? Consent?

      • Chris

        Ouch! Feel that buuuuuuuuurn.

        I love how she’s way more offended you insulted Steve than with what you did.

      • Chris

        Isn’t it sad that of all the time periods you could’ve lived, you live in the only one where being 20 years apart makes a difference? It actually got HARDER for you. This would be totally acceptable in every other previous time. If you lived in the 1800s age wouldn’t matter.

      • Nahida

        No, but race would.

      • Chris

        …You are sharp. I totally forgot.

        Yep, pretty much screwed in every universe then.

      • RTelier

        Isn’t consent what you’re so concerned about? If anything, you should be thanking me. He still hasn’t give you permission to write that you kissed him, which means he was never okay with it.

        You don’t know what you want, little girl. You’re lying to yourself just like Steve. I have no reason to believe you’re attracted to anything other than the fact that he’s an asshole.

      • Nahida

        He’s stubborn, decisive, interpretative, circumspect, self-directed, strong-valued, fervid, discerning, and recondite.

        Not that I owe you an explanation.

        I’m not a little girl. I’m a grown woman, and I know exactly what I want. You have no idea what you’re doing. I am not a force to be reckoned with.

        You said I love the wrong people, but I suppose you know who the right people are? You are the ultimate judge of character.

        You know, RTelier, we could have been friends. I can sense it. But you messed this up.

      • RTelier

        Be careful, Nahida. You are very close to hurting him. Now you’re sharing too much. You should have accused him of what I wanted you to, because that would have destroyed this bond. It would’ve hurt him less than this.

        I know why he’s not giving you his real birthday even though HE doesn’t know. He’s not suspicious that you’ll harm him on the surface because no surface harm is possible with just that information. It’s because he knows how to give, but he doesn’t know how to be taken, just like you said. But the thing is you have to be taken to give. And he’s not willing to be taken because he CAN’T be. You’re totally out of reach.

        while preserving whatever I am trying to preserve

        And he’s trying to preserve his heart. He’s not suspicious of you, he’s suspicious of his own ability for it to mean nothing if he gave you his birthday. He’s afraid he’ll think it means something, like he’s exposed. All while he can’t have you.

        You’re not going to get it from him. Too bad, because it’ll actually be pretty healthy for him to give it to you, to learn to be just a little taken. But he’s way too scared, he thinks he’s too weak even for that.

      • Nahida

        Destroyed this bond, and confirmed his suspicions that no one is to be trusted? He is stronger than he thinks he is. He wasn’t loved as much as he deserves. Yet observe his resolve!

        And so I will say it again. He’s stubborn, decisive, interpretative, circumspect, self-directed, strong-valued, fervid, discerning, and recondite. Let the truth penetrate him! It is time he accepted his own worthiness. He will not converse with me forever; this will eventually run its course. Perhaps soon. But whenever that is, I will see to it that he comes away assured and safe. And having realized that to give is nothing at all.

        RTelier, I am a veritably impossible person to love, and ironically, I can accept that about myself. But somehow I know how to unleash the beauty in other beings who harbor it, even though I contain none of it myself. Why shouldn’t they touch the universe with their grace? Why should they rob themselves of such a beautiful revelation? The slow unravelling of a strange, sweet, terrifyingly tender disclosure–if only by chance, or error–won’t change him forever, or make him stronger, but it will expand the prism of his possibility, and restore his hope.

        But only if he is willing, and gives freely. Otherwise he will only feel torn and powerless. That is why I am going to ask you to please exclude yourself from my request to him and let him make up his own mind.

        I really want to keep his birthday, for my own sentiment. But there is a reason I only I asked once. So seriously, RTelier, stay out.

      • Nahida

        And for the sweet love of God, STOP ACTING LIKE YOU KNOW PEOPLE.

      • RTelier

        Steve would never trust a liberal.

        Does it bother you, that under your sheets, you’ve been gasping the wrong name?

      • Chris

        Ok srsly dude WHAT IS YOUR PROBLEM.

      • Chris

        Stop it. You got a problem with her and you need to get a life.

      • Nahida

        I’ll have you know, RTelier, that I only did it 6 or 7 times. And I finished thrice.

      • Chris

        …Nahida, you’re just as hard-headed! Don’t be smug, just don’t reply to him and he’ll go away.

      • RTelier

        WAS IT GOOD NAHIDA!

      • Nahida

        IT WAS FANTASTIC.

      • Chris

        Ugh, I give up.

      • Chris

        RTelier, she’s a very loyal woman, she will sink with the ship. Just leave her alone.

      • Nahida

        Oh, Chris, Steve will surely disapprove of this.

        I was just so angry!

      • Chris

        Well, you were provoked. And to be honest, Nahida, I think Steve has pretty much lost his ability to become angry with you.

  43. Nahida

    If only I had the energy to organize a cult and convince you. But that would take donations. And doing bad things.

  44. Chris

    Nahida, how do you DEAL with getting rape threats everyday? I can’t even imagine.

    • Nahida

      What do you mean how do I deal with it? It’s totally normal.

      28 women in the US are raped every hour. Every hour. THIRTY-FIVE PERCENT of men report that if they could get away with it, there’s a likelihood they would commit rape. Eight percent admit to committing the legal definition of rape (when the word rape itself wasn’t used in the survey, just described) and out of that eight percent, eighty-four percent insist it definitely isn’t rape.

      Men don’t know what sexual harassment is. They don’t even know what rape is. 70% of victims don’t just say ‘no’ but STRUGGLE and fight back. And the men still continue. 20% of men say that they’ve become so sexually aroused before that they could not stop themselves from having sex even if the woman didn’t consent.

      And out of all those, between 62% and 84% of survivors were FRIENDS with their attacker. There’s a lot of hype about being raped by strangers, but you’re way more likely to be raped by a man you know. And that’s partly why only 5% are ever reported. It’s nearly always a man the woman cares about. That’s what we live in. A rape culture.

  45. Steve

    You are an incredibly easy person to love, Nahida.

  46. Selina

    She is . . . completely unaware of herself, unconscious of her fantastic power. When she catches a glimpse of it, she believes it comes from elsewhere.

    • Nahida

      *eyes comment opposedly* I really hope you aren’t talking about me.

      (Opposedly is a word I just made up, because I am too lazy to think of one that already exists in the adverb form and means the same thing. Do not use it in professional contexts. Unless you’re badass and don’t care.)

      I would prefer if RTelier weren’t right. I much rather Steve mistrust me than mistrust himself. If only he knew the true flightiness and clingyness I suppress! (noun form of ‘clingy’ I also made up–yeah, yeah, I am really tired right now) You know I actually found myself longing to know his name? How terribly immature. I feel very content and comfortable that he hasn’t used it, but I feel that I shouldn’t wonder either, even a little bit. I wish I weren’t so earnest, that I didn’t covet things that will inevitably fade into meaninglessness. I’m ridiculously, childishly happy that I have his IP address. Isn’t that silly? Just a string of numbers, and I act as though it’s an object I can hold and keep safe, like it’s something precious that makes me closer to him. It’s truly pathetic.

      If he only knew this and other things, he would see that I am impossible to love.

      Sometimes I fear I am more open on the internet than I am in real life; perhaps it is a good thing–the constant probability of loss reminds me once again why I am introverted. I wonder if I would relate to it different if it were invented much later in my lifetime and not made accessible until I’m as old as I am now, in university.

      I always figured Steve must have been smarter than me when he was 21, because he mentioned he thought about a lot of things, and admittedly I daydream much more than I think. I was surprised when he said otherwise of himself. He must be wrong; I am certain he was further along.

      • RTelier

        Oh, he knows all that already. I brought out how immature you can be.

      • Nahida

        RTelier, I hope you step on a Lego.

        I hope your pencil breaks right after you sharpen it.

        I hope you try really hard not to get toothpaste in the sink, but as you carefully apply toothpaste to your brush you get it in the sink.

        I hope you get 94.9 percent in a class and your instructor won’t round up.

        I hope you decide to become a butcher, and every time someone walks into your shop they joke, “What’s your beef?” as though you haven’t heard that one before.

        I hope you walk up to an ATM you always use and find that it now has a surcharge.

        I hope you turn on the radio just as your favorite song is ending.

        I hope you try to spread peanut butter but it’s the kind that has chunks of nuts in it so you can’t spread it without breaking the bread, but you can’t toast the bread to make it harder because you prefer untoasted bread.

        I hope you come to the couch in the living room with a bag of chips to watch your favorite TV show but you realize just as you’re comfortable that you left your drink on the counter.

        I hope you’re done shopping at the mall and so you come out to the parking garage for your car but you totally forgot where you parked it and start looking everywhere and just as you remember it’s at G4 you’re standing all the way on the other side at C3.

        And THEN I hope you try to give someone a high five but they don’t see you so you’re just in the middle of the street with a raised hand all awkward and you have to pretend to wipe something off your coat.

      • Steve

        I never said I wasn’t smarter. I wasn’t as mature as you. I am still not.

      • RTelier

        I hope you fall for a man twice your age who lives in a different state and is a conservative and then your roommate tells him.

      • Nahida

        Well obviously you’ve never stepped on a Lego.

      • RTelier

        Yeah, that was all very attractive, Nahida. (sarcasm)

      • RTelier

        You see that? He doesn’t actually think you’re smart at all.

      • Steve

        She is as smart as me, probably much smarter. She related how quickly she picked up English. I still don’t understand how she did because she said she was shielded from the outside world before Kindergarten.

        So, no actually now that I think about it she is probably a genius. That doesn’t mean she is correct about political issues as geniuses can still be wrong, very wrong.

        She is more sophisticated than I.

        And she is more mature despite being half my age.

      • John

        Actually, RTelier, I personally found Nahida’s response to be very attractive.

      • John

        She’s even cute when she’s wearing way too makeup. (No offense, Nahida.)

        Beautiful eyes. Your actual eyes, I mean, not just the stuff you put on them. They’re huge and look mysterious. Even through the picture looking into them is amazing.

      • Kevin

        Am I the only one who thinks that makeup looks really good?

        And yeah, Nahida, amazing eyes.

      • Nahida

        Really? Okay, well, that wasn’t the point. (It’s a performance of femininity invested in the artistic or outside of the acceptable “rules” of makeup application that restrict women to what is appealing to the male gaze–particularly the rule that you can’t have both bold eyes and lips because what a whore.) But thanks, I guess.

      • Brice

        So beautiful…what race are you?

      • Steve

        Brice I find that question quite rude.

        She is an American.

      • Nahida

        Brice, why do you spell your name incorrectly with an ‘i’ instead of a ‘y’?

        Startled at rudeness of the question? That’s how I felt.

      • Brice

        I guess I should have known before complimenting a feminist.

      • Nahida

        Wha–I–Ugh, actually. Yeah, just don’t even try to compliment me. You’re either going to fail miserably or I’ll have to cater to your bruised ego when I’m less than receptive as if I asked for an open critique of my appearance and owe you my gratitude for your efforts.

        Men are such babies.

      • Brice

        Don’t get all huffy, I can’t read your mind about who you’re going to be receptive to. You were fine with Steve saying it, so how is this fair?

      • Nahida

        It is totally and completely fair.

        Jesus Christ. It’s bad enough you all don’t understand something as simple as consent, but then you have to get all socialist with it.

      • RTelier

        This is EXACTLY what I was talking about! You can’t do ANYTHING anymore without offending a feminist. God forbid you compliment a woman. This is the hateful culture they promote. And they’re so hypocritical about it in their reaction. You reacted like a normal, decent woman to Steve.

      • Nahida

        You have got to be kidding me. I didn’t invite this. What makes everyone think it’s okay to simply start commenting like I’m a portrait or something for public consumption, even after I hinted as politely as possible that it was making me uncomfortable? Do you do this to men? And you are not entitled to my receptiveness, RTelier!

        Steve never acted like I owed him anything. Ever.

        And when he did it it was a private address, not a deliberate public discussion!

      • Steve

        I am so depressed that I am literally sick.

        I feel my country died today.

        You have to understand I grew up loving this country. Deeply. But, now, I don’t know. It’s such an awful feeling.

      • RTelier

        Please, Nahida, I think you know as well as I do that Steve would side with us on this one. It’s downright scary complimenting anyone anymore, because you’re all HATEFUL AND UPTIGHT. He told you something similar before. I know for a fact he agrees with me.

        And he’ll say so too. That’s the great thing about this. According to your OWN feminist ideology, he owes you nothing as well because he might have some weird soft spot for you, but he’s not your man. Chivalry is over!

      • Nahida

        What’s going on? What happened; is Steve being sarcastic? Have we been attacked? There’s nothing on the news!

      • Nahida

        No, we haven’t. Wildfires? Obamacare? Boring stuff about taxes I can’t bother to understand?

        Steve you nearly gave me a heart attack.

  47. Mark K.

    Interesting video that claims that Blacks on average have a lower IQ than any other race. I think that is kind of reflected in our society. She isn’t saying that there aren’t smart blacks out there but that on average blacks have a lower IQ.

    • Nahida

      That’s ridiculous. IQ scores are hardly indicative of intelligence. My own have been utterly unreliable. I was tested regularly throughout the first years of elementary school, scoring very high in kindergarten and first grade—until the second grade, when my scores plummeted, which I suspect is directly correlated to severe depression from a sharp increase of abuse at home and other unstable environmental factors. By the third grade, it increased drastically again, rising higher than most in my year, and I was enrolled into “gifted” classes.

      Let me tell you something about students who are considered “gifted”—the instructors behave differently toward them; they expect genius, and this results in more kindness and patience than they would allocate to other students. With my schedule full of honors classes in middle school especially, I detected the drastic difference between how instructors regarded “students like me” and those who lagged behind—even if their efforts were extensive. If I made a mistake an instructor would affectionately nudge me in the right direction; if one of the others did, an impatient sigh followed, and with an irritable tone the instructor simply provided them with the answer. I saw their faces crumble when teachers turned their backs. They rarely asked more than five times an entire year. Sometimes, if I took a mainstream course and there happened to be a student with a learning disability, I witnessed the teachers who were so kind with me turn into screaming monsters.

      And I remember of course, the second grade, and how that could have been me.

      While I don’t contest that genetics are partly responsible for intelligence (except for that one year, I performed very well on my own while enduring continuous abuse and depression) sometimes I am highly suspicious that the unstable environment in which I was raised thwarted a level of realization of my abilities. I learned to play the piano in one sitting, in a week was playing complete pieces, and I was told that if I wished I could skip the required arts class; I didn’t, because I’d always wanted to play the piano and was prohibited as a child from this and almost all other activities.

      Of course, we learn more slowly as we age—it is likely I will not fully recover whatever I might have lost.

      And so when there are low IQ scores from a specific person, and more emphatically from a specific demographic, it is undoubtedly fostered not only by unfavorable environmental factors that overwhelmingly characterize that demographic, but collaborating societal attitudes toward that demographic generating a self-fulfilling prophecy. And as we are a nation still very much divided by the social construct of race in our tendency to socialize with and marry within these races, the artificial cycle continues. IQ tests have also a long history of being composed and assembled so that one (dominant) demographic recognizes and relates to specific questions that pertain to their own cultural norms. When a female child is asked to move shapes to fit a certain space, she tends to fair poorly compared to a male child; when these shapes are displayed as furniture and the question is posed as one pertaining to interior design, she suddenly performs extraordinarily well—even though it’s the exact same test. What contributes to the different results is the myth that women are deficient in spatial intelligence; I’ve watched my own friends who outperformed men in this area gradually lose their aptitudes thanks to these prevailing attitudes. Boys are said to be genetically better at math and science, supposedly a justification as to why there are so few female engineers, but in China over half of engineers are women and women consistently match or outperform men. Since the assertion has exceptions in other societies, particularly cultures that have stridently valued high performance in both males and females in math and science, it simply cannot hold true that sex is an influential factor. Not nearly as influential as the attitudes that dictate how well one performs and that reiterate and reestablish an adverse cycle.

      And “innocent” statements like that contribute to it. I thought you were fired Derbyshire? Is this what you do with your time now?

      John–(re: makeup) well, if you read the tweet, that’s kind of the point.

  48. Steve

    See Nahida, I was right about the so called “Arab Spring”.

    http://web.gbtv.com/media/video.jsp?content_id=22573101

    • Nahida

      Steve, anything Glenn Beck ever says makes me burst into fits of uncontrollable laughter.

      I want a revolution in Egypt. Everyone deserves to establish their own government, and I absolutely expect that there will be total chaos and several failed attempts until they get it right. (According to my own American definition of “right” of course, in which extremism of any kind is firmly kept in check through the values of liberation in a democratic republic.) If a religious extremist government finds its way to top, it WILL be overthrown again. And again. And again. Unsettled ground is also the perfect condition for women to forge their way into restoring their rights; these women are already fighting the predatory behaviors of men: http://worldnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/06/08/12129468-women-brave-attack-to-protest-sexual-harassment-in-egypt?lite

      (I totally despise MSNBC. But it seems you never vary your sources.)

      And that is my primary concern. Let the women of Egypt take Egypt! Her place is in the revolution. I don’t care what happens, or how many times it takes, there as long as the feminist movement ultimately reclaims the powers that are rightfully theirs, and every ripple is a chance–and of course until Egypt actually becomes a real threat to American (and not just in the frantic imaginations of the right wing.)

    • Nahida

      Have you seen this? (No, you haven’t, because you don’t watch these guys, but I figured you might care to.)

    • Nahida

      http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/24/egypt-election-results-morsi-president_n_1622133.html

      What an improvement–anything’s better than a military controlled government! I hope Egyptians will keep his power in check.

    • Nahida

      It pisses me off that people whose their interpretation of Shari’ah law is the antithesis of Islam are called “Islamic extremists.” Additionally, who this guy runs with says necessarily says nothing about his prospective intentions (you think CAIR is a terrorist organization. *rolls eyes* Would you think I’m a terrorist if I decided to intern for them?)*, and what he’s claimed in the past is just the bullshit characteristic of all politicians employed to appeal to the culture of the masses, which I am convinced will be fought by the women in the revolution, and he will be FORCED to change with them.

      A greater democracy will follow eventually; it will not happen over night. And again, until they are a clear threat to the nation (not an imaginary one) I don’t care what happens beyond humanitarian interests and women’s liberation.

      *This is a serious question; I am thinking of doing this just to report to you that they aren’t a terrorist organization. (Of course if I find anything terrorist-y ANYWHERE I would report it… if the government listens to me at all that is [see video I posted])

      • Steve

        No, CAIR has nothing to do with terrorism. And the Italian American Anti-Defamation League had nothing to do with the mob, Joseph Colombo not a Mobster. In fact there is no such thing as the MAFIA. The Mafia is just some Hollywood Myth. The FBI in the 1970s didn’t talk about the MAFIA because the MAFIA doesn’t exist Oh and while we are at it the Rosenbergs – Innocent. And that whole Holodomor, you know that Ukrainian famine that supposedly Stalin caused. Total Lie. Walter Duranty said it was and he got a Pulitzer. Stalin wasn’t a mass murderer he was an agrarian reformer.

      • Steve

        Do you really think you could recognize evil if you saw it?

        They all don’t wear black hats and always laugh manically.

      • RTelier

        How are you so sure she isn’t one of them herself?

        Great disguise, isn’t it?

        I’m the only one who sees her what she is.

      • Nahida

        I know the difference between right and wrong. Would you claim otherwise?

        I don’t want anyone to get hurt, Steve. I don’t want anyone to get hurt unless they absolutely must for the safety of thousands more. In this resolve I can terrorize myself, plummeting so deeply into a maelstrom of examination that the simplest actions become forbidding and immense. I’ve inched toward the brink of insanity in attempting to convert whatever hatred that might emerge within myself into love. And I am certain that at some level I must have failed.

        And that is why, for the question of evil, the total creeper is right. I could very well be evil. I would be a fool to be deceived by even the characteristics I detect as positive within myself—or by the circumstances of my nature, or the hopes and desires I render pure and truthful. Why should I believe that I am calling on good when I may be calling on another? When I provide counsel, what if I imagine I truly care for others when my real desire is for them to adore me—or worse—to worship me? (I cannot describe enough how this terrifies me!) What if I show regret and retain the opposite in my heart? What if my modesty is secret self-praise, and my sincerity is reluctance?

        And you–you are greatly deceived. Can you say that you recognize evil? You thought I was hateful once! Are you sure you weren’t wrong, Steve? If you have changed your mind at any point, then you must have been wrong, either then or now. How can you be so sure of yourself in your identification of it?

      • Nahida

        Oh nothing is real.

        Why am I talking to Steve like this? I would never share these things before. It’s as though I’ve lost all filters. How dangerous and peculiar. I must stop speaking until I regain them. But where have they gone? Perhaps this is a symptom of something I haven’t foreseen. An illness!

        Too tired to think of what–my mattress may cure it.

    • RTelier

      I know for a fact that if you two were EVER possible, you’d never last.

    • Nahida

      For the love of God, RTelier, we’ve MOVED ON. Shut. Up. Jesus Christ. No one cares about indulging your broody feelings. Go sulk about your failed love life and hellbent vengeance via destroying other people’s somewhere else.

      • RTelier

        Not trying to crush his spirit. Just yours.

        I’d give you six months before he was done with you.

      • Nahida

        Ugh. Six months? Is that as well as you can do? He’d be finished with me in less than 2 weeks. Look, I know, okay? I know and accept everything you could ever possibly think of to bring me down–you needn’t allocate any time or effort to “crush[ing] my spirit” in regards to him because I assure you I am more than capable of accomplishing that myself… and! miraculously I can do it without annoying everyone else and interrupting normal conversation! So please–please–go away. And thank you.

      • Nahida

        FFS, if he won’t leave then I guess I’ll have to. I have things to do in the next two days anyway. *waves hand* Discuss without me.

      • RTelier

        She’s gone! I WON.

        Guess she couldn’t take it, after all. Yup, she was right, 2 weeks and Steve would be done with her.

        I knew I’d get to her!

  49. Steve

    Nadiha, did you see the Traudl Junge videos I posted?

    They are very important.

    • Nahida

      Steve, I saw them in class–the whole thing–a very long time ago. Hell, I wrote about them.

      I don’t understand where you see parallels; it sounds like an elaborate conspiracy. Are you truly suggesting that a people standing up to a government that has terrorized them–violated their most basic rights and left them impoverished and delirious–is equivalent to exterminating thousands? Are you getting this from the basic element of anti-Zionism (which is as different from being anti-Jew as “political Islam” is from the religion and people itself) and founding this absurd theory on solely that? The Egyptians are not blaming the Jews for their entire desolate state, they don’t want to completely exterminate a “race”; they just want food on their tables and dry beds and it is terrible and inhumane to stand in the way of that. (Do you REALIZE what things were like before? http://prospect.org/article/revolution) The fact that they’ve elected a declared Islamist means nothing–it’s a frequently applied label and political stance that indicates an entire range of things. The women involved in the revolution, especially, have been so brutally victimized and marginalized that they are far more engrossed in securing their own basic rights than destroying those of others. I can’t imagine they would ever take to such a thing while they are directly in conflict with the patriarchal paradigms of Egyptian men and an oppressive government (not one that wishes for them to be in the frontlines.) There would be something to worry about if they blamed their hardships on an entire race of people, but they don’t–they only blame their own government. The anti-“semitism” (wrong word for it I guess since it would also refer to themselves) that you see are merely the same tensions between Arabs and Jews that have been present for centuries, and since even before the conception of Islam. Neither of them have completely exterminated the other yet. I don’t doubt it’ll all explode at some point, but the damage will be overwhelming on either side.

      You commented on one of my posts, a long time ago, that if you were born there you might be a terrorist (do you remember this? I think it was regarding Quranic verses and misconceptions about killing non-Muslims and it was actually during the beginning of the Arab spring) but that we live in America and so we should be on THIS side–I was horrified with you, absolutely horrified, as I didn’t and don’t think that terrorism is ever conceivable regardless of where one lives or in what political environment. But you’re saying now that there is a clear presence of evil and you know exactly what it is? You can suddenly identify it this precisely?

      • Steve

        I am not Mark.

        But when the President of Egypt (or his followers) say that the capital of the new Islamic Caliphate (Beck doesn’t sound so crazy now does he) is Jerusalem, well you could see how videos of the Holocaust is relevant.

        But, I am not a Jew. My concern must be on America as that should be the concern of all Americans. I mean if Egypt did destroy Israel perhaps that is exactly what America needs to wake itself up. Not to say I wouldn’t be sad about all the horrors, but still in the end I would understand the need as an American citizen to focus on America.

        And focusing on America we are just about to lose a critical ally in a pretty critical part of the world. It’s Jimmy Carter’s Iranian Revolution playing itself over again (minus the US Hostages).

        As an American you need to understand what dangers an Islamic Caliphate is to us. Just like the concept of communism could unite countries during the Cold War, the concept of Islamic Caliphate is uniting countries against us now.

        As to could I understand becoming a terrorist. Well perhaps not the suicide part, but yeah, I guess I could understand it if I was some Palestinian or something like that. But I am not. I am an American. You are too, and I am not saying you aren’t but it is important for all of us to know Whose Side We Are On and of course that should be on the side of our citizenship.

        By the way, I have also criticized conservatives for being too pro-Israel. I think that is just as wrong. I might sympathize with Israel because they seem so, so much more reasonable than the Palestinians but in the end we must do what is in our best interests. I just don’t think seeing Israel destroyed is in our interests, unless it really does wake Americans up to what the Left has done to us.

      • Nahida

        …I wasn’t suggesting you were. I was referring strictly to your video of Beck.

        I don’t think you understand what a caliphate is any more than you understand what shari’ah is. Although I suppose there is no reason you should, since they mean completely different things in different countries, cultures, and contexts. But that’s just it. You have no idea what he actually means. And I have no interest in keeping citizens of a country from establishing their own government until it is a clear threat to us–which, at this point, it simply isn’t. They have way too much on their plates. And chances are, things that are a threat to us are a threat to them as well. That’s how it always has been. Happy countries do not attack the United States. They’ll want it overthrown again.

      • Nahida

        I am the Left, Steve. Have you seen your enemy? Do you know her?

      • Steve

        The Capital of the New Caliphate WILL be Jerusalem? Are you saying the destruction of Israel will be a good thing for America? If you are indeed saying it from that perspective (what is good for OUR country) then I will be interested in your thoughts . I don’t see how it could be good for America except perhaps in waking our citizens up to Obama and the Left.

      • Nahida

        I’m saying the new president of Egypt is having delusions of grandeur. There’s no way he can establish a caliphate in the classical sense.

      • Nahida

        Which is why I’m convinced you’re not thinking on the same wavelength. He probably doesn’t even mean what you think he does.

      • Nahida

        I don’t understand why it’s so hard to convince you I’m not a snowflake when you think the entire Left is flat-out evil. This should be not be difficult.

      • Steve

        It’s not going to happen overnight, but within the next decade or so, why not?

        They are going to probably distance themselves from America. Become another Iran.

        I feel for your Israeli friend. She’s toast. But then again, from what I can tell from the Internet Israel is kind of a degenerate society and they are always butting in to each other affairs.

        You would be right to say that my side is too “Israeli focused”. And from what I can tell it mostly come from a religious perspective. And that is just as wrong as those in America who would be supporting the Palestinians.

        We aren’t supposed to be pro-Israel or pro-Palestinian. We are supposed to be PRO AMERICA. I was very upset to see Glenn Beck go to Israel like he did last year.

        That said, I can never forget who cheered and passed out candy on 9-11. Perhaps if I was a Palestinian I would have too, but I am not. I am an American and it just makes poor foreign policy to treat your allies like your enemies and your enemies like your allies.

      • Nahida

        There’s no way he can establish a caliphate in the classical sense.

        Steve, listen to me. The Arab countries are expansively different in culture, laws, and language. There is no way they can maintain themselves under one caliphate. Why do you think the caliphate failed in the first place? It was way too diverse for one leader. (Aren’t you the one always arguing that multiculturalism cannot be sustained and function in unity?) ESPECIALLY now, since centuries have passed and more foundational differences have emerged. Do you think every other “Islamic” country is simply going to surrender its culture and distinct lifestyles to an Egyptian caliphate? They’ll destroy each other for power. The only thing uniting them now is their support of Palestine. They have nothing after that regardless of what direction the result—whether Palestine survives or not—once that has been settled, they are destined to be disunited and forced to rule themselves as separate nations.

      • Steve

        Perhaps you are right and a single Caliphate will never be possible.

        But that doesn’t mean these countries can’t unite in attacking the West.

        As for the Palestinians, they are ungovernable. Given their own state they will us it to attack Israel.

        But then again, that’s the Israelis problem not ours. And I am not being sarcastic in that statement. Perhaps we are too captive in our thoughts to worrying about Israel’s welfare when the purpose of American foreign policy is supposed to be to serve American Interests.

        I guess I don’t see how an hostile Egypt, an hostile Libya, a hostile Syria, a hostile Iran, can be in the US national interest.

        It certainly shows how we need to stop being dependent on foreign oil. But there again, Obama is limiting our capacity to do that.

        Look, I know Obama has to win this year for our country to even have a chance, but isn’t it obvious that his goal is to indeed destroy America the country he hates so much.

      • Nahida

        Those countries will not be hostile toward us as long as we stay the hell out of them. All of them. They have no reason to unite as allies against us if we’re not interfering.

        We become involved in too many things.

        I don’t want the Palestinians to destroy Israel (not that they’re even close; the Israelis are occupying their land.) If they did come close I would say we needed to be involved at once—only for humanitarian interests, to see to it that as few people die horrendous deaths as possible, not supporting one side or another. It’s the same if the Israelis come close to obliterating Palestine and the horrific acts of terrorism they’ve committed against them already. We shouldn’t be interfering in the governments of other nations. And certainly not establishing them ourselves or paying them billions like what we’ve funneled to Israel. Has it occurred to you that that’s why Palestine dislikes us and would STOP?

      • Steve

        I would be against US intervention (which yeah would probably put me against about 70 percent of my side) because we can’t just go around intervening for “humanitarian reasons” or we would be intervening everywhere (wait aren’t we?). We should only intervene when US interests are at stake.

        Nahida, Israel has never committed acts of terrorism against the Palestinians. If anything they have been “too good” for their own good.

        Gosh, I often wonder if suicide isn’t in their genes. Given the situation they find themselves in they need to be much more ruthless.

        But again, I am not Israeli so my focus must be on America. Would a Palestinian state ever be an US ally? No, never.

        I have often thought you should go to visit your Israeli friend. Israel isn’t as dangerous as we think it as being. But no, you have the additional risk of your ethnicity (though aren’t there a lot of people in Israel that look like you so perhaps you would blend in) and of course your religion (though people couldn’t tell unless you let them know).

        I once thought of going to Israel just to visit, you know to see historical sites, not to take sides one way or the other, but no, I thought – too dangerous. If it was too dangerous for me then it would be too dangerous to you and I am not sure that El Al would let you on (though I wouldn’t think that religion alone wouldn’t be a reason to bar you, as Israel is a very liberal society and I would think they would need more than that but perhaps I am wrong).

      • Nahida

        I really want this revolution. A government should be established by its people. But I think it’s wrong that Americans were protesting on the streets in Egypt along with Egyptians–and they are from the same side who claim to understand the atrocities of colonialism (mine.) There’s a difference between showing support for your values of democracy and beliefs in liberation and extending humanitarian aid… and between contributing to a history of interference over an impoverished and oppressed people by acting as their allies when you KNOW you may have to destroy them if they try to threaten you first. I think that is so cruel. If I must be your enemy I should have the decency not to deceive you as a pretend ally! Especially since we have the upper hand. No, the Left and the Right need to let Egypt do whatever the hell Egypt wants to do, within itself, until they begin to attack other nations (if they are indeed under the ridiculous impression they can establish a caliphate, they will have to use force). That would be our time. Not now.

      • Steve

        What possible US interests could this revolution serve?

        We really needed the stability that Egypt provided before this revolution.

        And I agree with you about those Americans who were protesting. You never have the right to protest in a foreign country – NEVER! For any reason!

        See we found agreement. Amazing.

      • Nahida

        Anyone would be your ally if you knew how to communicate with them.

        *snort* Israel has been ATROCIOUS to Palestine. And they are on occupied land. I’m not saying they shouldn’t be there. (That would make me a hypocrite, since I am also on occupied land.) But you would think that would shame them into not committing acts of terrorism (there are other kinds besides those that involve suicide you know)–no, they think they’re entitled to it!

        And I don’t think passing out food, clothes, and bandages in intervening. If anyone takes this as a reason to attack us they are LOOKING for excuses… intervening is what we are doing when we pay more to Israel than we can even afford.

      • Nahida

        The interest of another democracy! (Did you know two REAL democracies–I don’t mean rule by the majority of course, just that everyone has a say, a republic–have never gone to war with one another? I mean where everyone as a say regardless of race or sex. You can say it just hasn’t been long enough, but I think it’s interesting regardless.) Egypt was not stable before. That is not true stability; it’s an illusion.

      • Nahida

        though aren’t there a lot of people in Israel that look like you so perhaps you would blend in

        Do they? I have no idea. I’m not sure what race I look like.

        I have quite a few friends in Israel, actually, particularly in Tel Aviv.

      • Steve

        Everyone lives on land that at one time was occupied by someone else.
        It is just a matter of how far back they go.

        But apart from “occupying land” Israel has not committed “terrorist attacks” against the Palestinians. If anything from their perspective they haven’t been ruthless enough. When I was talking about suicide I meant the Israelis. Hello, the world hates you. You can’t afford not to be ruthless.

        I kind of criticize how the Jews behaved during the Holocaust as well. They should have not allowed themselves just to be lined up like cattle. I am not saying they could have taken the Nazis, but they could have taken a bunch of them with them.

        You should visit Israel. I mean of course if you could do it safely. You would get a totally different perspective.

      • Chris

        contributing to a history of interference over an impoverished and oppressed people by acting as their allies when you KNOW you may have to destroy them if they try to threaten you first.

        I think that is so cruel. If I must be your enemy I should have the decency not to deceive you as a pretend ally!

        Wow. With an enemy as courteous as Nahida, who needs friends?

      • Steve

        Tel Aviv from what I understand is a pretty safe place. In fact too safe in the respect that citizens of Tel Aviv don’t really get how dangerous it is in other parts of Israel, especially of course the closer you get to the border.

        There are rockets that are routinely launched at these border towns, but no the citizens of Tel Aviv really don’t care about it. No, it’s like another world to them.

        So, perhaps you wouldn’t get much of a different perspective. Still it would be a fun trip.

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Palestinian_rocket_attacks_on_Israel,_2012

      • Nahida

        They didn’t “allow” anything. They would have been shot individually. If they attempted to collaborate, they were being watched at all times. Some of the kids tried to escape, though. I saw so on Schindler’s List.

        My mom made the mistake of watching that movie sitting when I was 4 while taking care of me. She didn’t think I would understand anything. She realized how petrified I was when I vomited.

        The world doesn’t hate Israel, Israel just thinks the world hates Israel (with good reason of course.) And then it goes and bombs schoolhouses and gives the world justification for hating it.

        I might actually go to Tel Aviv, but I have a wedding to attend in Cape Town in a couple of years and I’m saving for that first. It’s an important one; the woman getting married would be the imam performing the ceremony in mine if I ever got married.

      • Steve

        I would have fought, Nahida.

        I might have died, but I would have taken a damn Nazi along with me.

      • Nahida

        I would have fought too. I’m just saying it’s absurd to judge anyone for not fighting.

  50. Steve

    You asked me if you interned at CAIR if that would make me think that you were a terrorist. No, but it wouldn’t convince me that CAIR wasn’t a terrorist organization.

    I can literally imagine you filing papers, greeting guests in the reception room, while all along in the closed office behind you your boss is helping to funnel money to al Quada, or help coordinate some terrorist attack. And you honestly wouldn’t know.

    And if your boss was arrested you would be angry. You don’t know him. When I was interning with him he was the sweetest of people. He really treated my with respect even though I was merely an intern. He always seemed interested in what I had to say. He isn’t a terrorist.

    And you would be honest about that. Because you only saw a part of him. Not saying even he was deceiving you, but he only showed you a part of him.

    You know I remember once I really wanted to know if Hitler was a “nice guy”. Not to justify him, not to mitigate history’s valid judgment of him, nor to say he wasn’t the evil the world knew him to be.

    But to understand that within most all of us, even the most evil, there are good qualities. Actually it was just in case I was ever to meet a evil man not to be taken in if he indeed seemed like a generally nice person.

    We tend to call these people “Monsters”. Do we do so not to condemn them so much as to try to distance ourselves from them? But are they closer to the rest of us than we really want to admit. Not you Nahida, because of what you are, but I am referring to the rest of us. It is because the rest of us are not so different than a Hitler that you type exist.

    • Nahida

      But I’m not that type.

      And I was actually meaning to sneak around a bit… (which further proves I am not that type you think I am.)

      There’s no point in thinking about it anyway; there’s no way they would take me. They’d just have to Google my name and everything is there–they’d see me as an immediate annoyance–maybe even a threat. (You wouldn’t think so, but I know.) When I was contacting a bunch of social networking sites to notify them of sexual harassment regarding the incident I told you about, one of the feminists suggested contacting CAIR (because the nature of his attacks weren’t only sexual but Islamophobic) and another one of them scoffed and retorted, “I don’t think CAIR would give a damn. Not two flying fucks.”

      I agreed. With what I do, there would be no way they wouldn’t take the opportunity to silence me rather than help. So I doubt I could intern for them.

  51. Nahida

    Steve, do you believe one must be Christian to go to Heaven? Won’t think anything of it if you do; I’m just wondering. I remember you said a long time ago you didn’t know if God exists, but it seems you still refer to yourself as a Christian. (I guess a person can never really stop being the religion they were once, unless they actively convert to a different faith and practice it.)

    • Steve

      That would depend on whether I believe in a Heaven.

      The honest question is I don’t know. I guess one of the bad things about my religion is that it says that the only way one goes to Heaven is to be “Born Again” in Christ. It’s hard to get around that

      Yeah, I sometimes do call myself a Christian. I mean that more Culturally than I do religiously. But what did Sarah say in the second to the last episode, traditions die hard (and then she burns down the church)? I still haven’t related all my thoughts on the last few episodes, especially the symbolism behind the church burning. I will do that soon.

      • Nahida

        Well… do you believe in Hell?

        Sometimes I believe in Hell more than I believe in Heaven. Sometimes it is easier that way. Sometimes I wish Judgement Day would come and everything would be sorted, and I could just get on with whatever I deserve for all of Eternity instead of waiting, in this human form, with a soul that desires things it cannot name and the churning promise of possibility. Like some dystopic dream, rounding the same circuit over and over again. Everything I do is so inconsequential in the grand scheme.

      • Nahida

        At moments I have… a shadow of the sense that I am making Steve uncomfortable, but I don’t know why. Would he say so straight out if it were true? Perhaps I am over critical of myself in this, because I’m socially inept, undoubtedly a symptom of introversion. Is it imaginary, Steve, or are you really uncomfortable? And if so is it the subject itself (so that I know not to bring it up again) or somehow my approach, or anything about me?

      • Steve

        No, it’s okay. It’s just that sometimes the blog won’t let me post if I post too many posts in a small amount of time.

        Also I have work do to and stuff like that. This is a hard place to “chat”.

        As to answer you question, if I don’t believe in an Heaven then I don’t believe in a Hell. Right now, I am not sure what I believe spiritually. I want to believe but the logic behind not believing seems to make more sense.

      • Nahida

        Sorry! I know you have work. I just wasn’t sure if I’d offended you. (Some people are very private about this subject after all.)

        How funny, believing seems so much more logical to me than not believing.

      • RTelier

        Leave him alone. He doesn’t have time for you. GROWNUPS have to work.

      • Nahida

        I like you, RTelier. You remind me of when I was young and stupid.

      • Steve

        RTelier, shut up. I welcome Nahida’s questions and will try to answer her more fully by tomorrow.

      • Steve

        Today is a little busy but either today or tomorrow.

    • Nahida

      I kind of don’t believe people have to live as Muslims to go to Heaven. I tried very, very hard to believe it. My hardest. But I don’t.

      To be frank I don’t see why other Muslims do when the Qur’an says the opposite.

      It bothers me that I’m not moved in the same way as the Muslims in my community. One of them gave a sermon in which he said that there are all different kinds of keys to insert into paradise, and you can form your key as you live your life, but if it doesn’t have the correct ridges it won’t open the lock to the gates of paradise. Even though you have a key, it’s the wrong one. Everyone clapped admirably and looked at him in awe.

      And all I could think was, What do the other keys open then?

      It is so depressing. I am certain something must be wrong with me. And I am frightened I would be unfit for any religious work.

  52. Steve

    Nahida, I visit some of the Russian English websites and they can’t stand the Israelis.

    It’s that way through much of Europe.

    It’s almost as bad, if not as bad as the 1930s

  53. Steve

    We basically don’t have a constitution anymore.

    Our government’s power is absolute.

    That was exactly what so many fought to the death to fight against, but now it has happened.

    This is the day America died!

    If you aren’t absolutely sick, i mean throwing up sick, then you never loved what America was supposed to mean in the first place.

    • Nahida

      Is this what you’re talking about?


      On the individual mandate, the opinion said that “the Affordable Care Act’s requirement that certain individual’s pay a financial penalty for not obtaining health insurance may reasonably be characterized as a tax.”

      “Because the Constitution permits such a tax, it is not our role to forbid it, or to pass upon its wisdom or fairness,” Roberts wrote.

      • Nahida

        There are, however, a number of exemptions. For instance, the penalty will be waived for people with very low incomes who are members of certain religious groups, or who face insurance premiums that would exceed 8% of family income even after including employer contributions and federal subsidies.

        …Members of certain religious groups?

      • Steve

        You know Roberts was appointed by President George W. Bush. What a traitor to the constitution.

        If Government can mandate this, it can mandate everything. Government Power is absolute.

        We need some constitutional amendment limiting the terms of these people. Perhaps like to 10 years or so and then Congress has to vote to renew their appointments or not.

        We are so, so far away from what this government was supposed to be. We might as well just throw the constitution away as we sure aren’t using it.

        There is something known as IMPEACHING A Supreme Court JUDGE. We have never done it before, but perhaps now would be a good time to start.

    • Nahida

      Is it solely the penalty tax and the obligatory purchase that bothers you Steve or do you have issues with other parts as well?

      • Steve

        America died today.

        Welcome to TOTALITARIANISM!

        And yeah I realize that a Republican Appointee was the deciding vote.

        I hate the Republicans – they are co-conspirators.

  54. Steve

    Rtellier, you lost me at asking Nahida’s race. Sorry, but that was unconscionable.

    • RTelier

      That wasn’t me, that was Brice.

      Don’t you think it’s interesting MOST of her friends are foreign? Tel Aviv? Cape Town? What else?

      • Steve

        You know I should warn Nahida that Cape Town is the rape capital of the World. If you want to talk about danger, going to South Africa is MUCH, MUCH more dangerous than going to Israel.

      • Steve

        I think it is because she is in College. There’s a lot of foreign students in our Universities. They supplement the tuition that US students pay by paying much more to attend. But in the process they take up desks that could be used for US students especially in the lower and middle classes.

      • Nahida

        They are not “foreigners” because they don’t live here. They live in their own countries. (Except the Israeli friend I met on a plane; she has residency here, but she is in a different city and I hardly see her.)

        I don’t know them through university. For some reason I just have a habit of running into them. I don’t know why. I never thought about it before, but I guess it is a bit strange. That’s just how the universe seems to work with me. And I do get closer to people who live farther away. I guess I love better from far away. (This makes me sad.) There are a couple of things I find a bit overwhelming when people are very close in physical distance; I’m always subconsciously wondering if they’ll tire of me. Sometimes one of my friends will call and I will deliberately not pick up my cell, even if I truly want to talk to her and miss her, because… I don’t even know. I’m just afraid of something. And sometimes they talk about things–their classes or their love lives–and I just start daydreaming and I feel really terrible. They don’t seem to mind, but I still feel as though I’m doing something wrong. I’ll be there when they *need* me, when they have a problem, but usually not otherwise… I’m actually a terrible friend; I have no idea why people keep wanting me around.

        Would you believe it if I told you you probably know more about me than my roommates, Steve? Except for the part where you think I’m a snowflake because that’s WAY wrong, but I mean just in terms of basic facts and…what I think and stuff, I guess.

        You don’t need to warn me about Cape Town. Of course I know. But this is so important, and I love her so much. And of course I never get to see her, ever.

      • Nahida

        It is a terrible curse, to continuously fall in love with people you cannot see.

        I must have committed a grievous sin in my life.

      • RTelier

        Nahida, you sound like a freak. I probably don’t even have to intervene at all, just let you keep talking and he won’t want you himself!

      • Steve

        Nahida, just remember they aren’t Americans. I don’t mean that they are better or worse, but they aren’t Americans. And that has lots of implications.

        Specifically for your Israeli friends, that means you are probably going to see them die.

      • Nahida

        Steve, you have seen that I am capable of strongly sympathizing with Palestine (much more than I do with Israel) while having Israeli friends; are you wary of my loyalty to America based on my friendships?

        I love them because they love their countries.

      • Nahida

        That’s how you know when to love someone, when they can love something like that.

      • Nahida

        The love fundamental abstract ideals that root themselves into the value of stark reality–an immovable kind of love, unchanging, through even the most desperate and enraging turn of events, so genuine and deep because of what it must survive… it’s the kind of love that kills you.

      • Nahida

        I don’t think America is the greatest country in the world. Our educational system itself is less than impressive. We are TERRIBLE at foreign policy. We are terrible at a lot of things.

        But dammit I will go down with the flames. I’ll burn in hell before I stop. I couldn’t stop if I tried. It’s deep, gushing, alarmingly endless and expansive; I don’t even think it comes from me… I don’t think any human being could harbor this. I wonder where it comes from.

      • Steve

        I just feel sorry for you Nahida.

        America MAY survive Obama.

        Israel will not.

        You probably have about a year left to visit your friends in Israel, perhaps two. But after that you are going to have emails from them that will chill your bones.

        And then you won’t get any emails from them.

      • Steve

        America used to be the greatest country on the face of this earth.

        Now it is the least bad.

        After today I don’t even know I can say that.

      • Nahida

        You don’t need to feel sorry for me.

        I know who I am. I know who they are. I will not contain my love in the prism of my ideology because of catalysts of the devil.

      • RTelier

        Are you listening to her?!

      • Nahida

        RTelier give yourself a break. You got what you wanted.

      • Steve

        How did he get what he wanted?

        I just mean that when the Israelis are all killed, that would mean your friends will be killed. And the Israelis will all be killed. Obama will insure that.

        Damn, and I have to vote for Obama. It is the only chance America has.

      • Grant

        Nahida, what do you think of this Mp3 audio program?

        [audio src="http://stevedeace.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/deace-hour-3-062712.mp3" /]

      • Akhed

        The more Jews killed the better!

      • RTelier

        Hey Nahida, he says he chose not to fight in the war. Does that bother you? DOESN’T it?

      • Steve

        Gosh, I guess Tel Aviv is more dangerous than I thought it was.

        I thought it was safe “right now”.

        Don’t go Nahida. I don’t want to see you hurt.

      • Nahida

        RTelier, don’t you fucking go there; I will punch you so hard that by the time you come down you’ll need a passport and a plane ticket to get back.

        What kind of woman do you think I am?

      • Steve

        What war? I was in College for the First Gulf war.

        It’s not like I am a draft dogger.

        I registered at age 18 like I was supposed to do.

        We do have a volunteer military. I didn’t think I was qualified.

        Were you in the military?

      • Nahida

        You know, I have two little brothers. They are both rather frail. One of them just turned 18. And he had to do what all 18-year-old boys do and register. My mother panicked for a moment when until I told her he’d probably never actually have to go.

        I’m 97 pounds but I was nearly always the fastest runner on the track team. And I’m a great swimmer. I think I was born for water; I feel much more comfortable in the water than on land. If I wanted to kill myself I’d probably drown. Morbid thought, but you’d enjoy it.

        Despite the athleticism when it comes to running and swimming, I don’t have much strength, but I would be better fit for the military than both my brothers. And I most deeply sympathize with the pressures your damn patriarchy pushes on men who aren’t athletic. That, and I’m half a decent human being.

        And THIS. This is what you will never understand about me, and this is what you will never understand about feminism. Because your goddamn head is up your ass. And you’re so busy policing love that you don’t recognize it. Do you think this superficiality is a standard? Feminists. Love men, differently.

        Steve, how didn’t he get what he wanted?

        And you’re exaggerating; Israel isn’t coming to an end, and definitely not that soon. And whoever’s using the stereotypical Muslim freak for a handle–cut it out.

      • RTelier

        You don’t really care. You feminists never talk about it. Nahida, you’re as heartless and shallow as every other woman.

      • Nahida

        Why the hell should we talk about it? Do your own damn work. We don’t stick ourselves where we don’t belong. I know that’s hard for you to understand, seeing how eager you are to legislate our reproductive freedoms and confiscate our rights–but we’re too busy trying to get you to stop raping us to chitchat about how tough a little peer pressure is for men.

      • RTelier

        Heartless, just like I said. My point has been proved.

      • Stewart

        Nahida, could you please listen to the audio file that Grant put up and give your comments?

        [audio src="http://stevedeace.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/deace-hour-3-062712.mp3" /]

      • Nahida

        I tried, just now, and I could not get past the ridiculous introduction about Obama acting like God or saying it’s not a Christian nation. -________-

      • Nahida

        Is this what you’re talking about?

        And why didn’t you link me the video instead? Because the way they were TALKING about it in the soundclip made the Christians look like innocent angelic messengers who were NOT trying to be provocative at all? “Civil rights rally”?! Are you kidding me? The Right LOVES false analogies.

        They should not have been doing that at the Muslim Arab Festival. And that was definitely a horrendously annoying thing for the Christians to be shouting. (Do Christians know how annoying they are when they proselytize? I can’t even stand Muslims who proselytize. I would especially be FURIOUS if they did it at a Christian event.)

        That said the Muslims reacted like barbarians and should be charged with assault. And those children need to watch their language. Charge them all with assault–wtf are they doing throwing dangerous shit.

      • Stewart

        Skip through that part. It is a very important program. Please.

      • Stewart

        The Press didn’t report on this!

        The Police ALLOWED IT TO HAPPEN! They literally turned their backs!

        And you wonder why people are getting so angry! It’s the hypocrisy as much as anything else!

      • Nahida

        I kinda wouldn’t blame Christians for reacting like that if Muslims were that damn annoying.

      • Nahida

        People are allowed to respond to harassment with harassment.

        The Muslims deserve to be charged for turning it into assault.

      • Nahida

        I hope I never find myself in Dearborn. What a ridiculous city.

      • Nahida

        I wanted to say “trashy” but that word really hurts me for some reason. And I suspect it might be anti-feminist (depending on whether it’s classist; I’d have to look up the origin… I think it might be along the same lines as “white trash” and that would explain why it hurts a little; I can usually trust my gut) So yeah, ridiculous. Wasn’t there an atrocious reality show about Muslims in Dearborn or something? Good God.

      • Steve

        Israel will not make it through the Obama’s second term.

        And yeah, I believe that Obama will win the election this year.

        So, yeah, your Israeli friends they are toast. Literally. So don’t make any long term plans with them.

      • Nahida

        I swear sometimes Steve just says things for the sake of highly disturbing imagery.

      • Nahida

        Why would you keep making this personal?

      • RTelier

        Well maybe you shouldn’t of told him every detail of your life so he could use it against you emotionally.

      • Nahida

        You stay out of it.

      • RTelier

        What is it with women and drowning themselves? That’s what they always do, like there was that girl in Hamlet. Either that or poison, or they stick their head in an oven. Some poet..

      • Nahida

        Ophelia. Her name was Ophelia.

        I don’t know why they always drown themselves.

        I have a theory about Ophelia. When she gazed at the water she thought of Clytemnestra. Mothers, she assured herself, have a duty, and virgin sacrifices have the power to move the wind for battleships. “But my mother is dead,” said Ophelia. “And she only left me her mirror.”

        I have a theory about Ophelia. Men taught her how to be a woman, but when she was young her mother would place her on a swing; her heart would fester in excitement and fear, on the brink of danger, and she thought, That must be how it feels when she drowned herself.

        I have a theory about Ophelia. She merely slipped. They made up lies as they debated how to bury her to assure themselves they hadn’t failed; she must have been heartbroken over Hamlet. “Indeed, my lord, you made me believe so.” It wasn’t that their plan hadn’t worked; it worked too well, or so they told themselves. They needed to know they controlled her will. But really, Ophelia, slipped.

        I have a theory about Ophelia. In fact, she never even existed. How can a woman exist, constructed by men—what creature is the result? Ophelia could not have been a sinner to be buried with sinners. For she could only be a breeder of sinners: Get thee to a nunn’ry, why woulds’t thou be a breeder of sinners?That was their mistake. Hamlet was a sinner, bred by his mother, and his sexual revulsion took him over, childishly, the privileged menace.

        I have a theory about Ophelia. She was a slut, and a virgin, and the universe split open. And the wind cried, “What sacrifice is this?”

        I have a theory about Ophelia. She thought she saw the stars in the water; they called, “If this life doesn’t offer the happiness you expect, honey, there’s always the next.”

        I have a theory about Ophelia, and it broke her heart. I have a theory about Ophelia, and it broke her heart. I have a theory about Ophelia, and it broke her heart. I have a theory about Ophelia, and it broke the vase that Hamlet grabbed in the corridor, impassioned, and threw against the wall; the glass shards glimmered like water drops. Ophelia watched in madness.

        Her soul was trapped inside the pond, where it had been put away for safekeeping so that she could not realize she was not truly alive. Hamlet was a coward–“to be.” A woman knows dreams.

        I have a theory about Ophelia. Gertrude slid her a note that said, “Before he kills you.” And Ophelia cried, “Dammit, I deserve to tread the primrose path of dalliance.” She had been good for too long. And strong for too long. Women drown themselves; she valued the legacy.

        I have a theory about Ophelia. She was mad. Batshit insane, mad like Hamlet and mad that no one would exclaim, “What has come over Ophelia?” Because Hamlet insisted on whining so incessantly. And they insisted on whining with him. She wasn’t really a virgin, in fact, she slept with every man in the play. Her wandering womb is to blame.

        I have a theory about Ophelia. She was the purest of virgins. And Hamlet was a virgin too, and they died destined for each other, too good for this world of lies, treachery, and murders.

        I have a theory about Ophelia. Hamlet was done with her. He had realized Ophelia is not his mother, whom he very much wanted her to be, so he delivered her some sick twisted lecture, condemning Gertrude, because Ophelia—is Gertrude in the wrong way.

        I have a theory about Ophelia. She secretly drove the whole plot. Her mother was murdered by her father, before the wedding, and Claudius helped—so vengefully she dressed herself as Hamlet senior and fooled her love into believing she was a ghost. Fooled her love into believing he must murder the king. It was easy; he was a foolish man.

        I have a theory about Ophelia. She read about Helen of Troy, who said, “Well fuck that.”

        I have a theory about Ophelia. When Gertrude killed her own husband, Ophelia stood over the body and clenched the knife and shouted, “You should have used poison!” And she cried for Gertrude’s soul, righteously, but not too hard, because she knew she may have to become her, someday. She was silent, cautiously.

        And she walked along the water’s edge, and she sighed, “This larger death is nothing more, than the smaller deaths I’ve felt before.”

        She was never allowed to look into the mirror her mother left her; she was the empty mirror instead.

        This larger death is nothing more than the smaller deaths I’ve felt before.

        I’m not fond of that play.

  55. Steve

    You know, if I was a few years older, I think I would literally have a heart attack.

    I am kind of glad now that I didn’t serve my country. I always felt bad about that but I was never the athletic type and always thought I would do more bad than good serving- well I knew I couldn’t get pass Basic training.

    But just think how betrayed people who put their lives on the line must feel today.

    Worse decision since Dred Scott. Perhaps even worse than Dred Scott. We are all slaves now!

  56. Steve

    Why should I trade one tyrant three thousand miles away for three thousand tyrants one mile away? An elected legislature can trample a man’s rights as easily as a king can.

  57. Richard

    Nahida is a direct danger to this country. Who she prefers as company is proof.

  58. Chris

    So Nahida is a wordly woman. So what? That doesn’t make her less American.

    As a matter of fact, she’s a huge asset to this country. We should get her on foreign policy.

    • Richard

      She’s a radical feminist, with more foreign friends than American ones! And she keeps to herself real suspicious – how does Steve explain why she can’t relate fully to normal people?

      • Nahida

        Normal people? Because… I’m not normal?

        I am quite certain that I’m 100% average as a human being. And what you’ve said isn’t fair; even as I lack in all other virtues, the only constant quality I seem to harbor is deep empathy–at least as far as I’ve been told I’m a deeply empathetic person. I only have a thousand faults in how I fail to put it to use.

        What a strange activity; to simultaneously tear myself down and defend myself–all in an exhausting attempt to be seen as an equal!

      • RTelier

        He’s only being kind to her out of politeness now, he has no real desire for her.

        She deserves it, for all the hearts broken by women like her. They keep men as slaves and torture them.

      • Nahida

        Well if you know you got what you wanted, RTelier, why do you insist on attempting to torment me?

        Drop your ridiculous charges against my sisters; they’ve done no such thing.

      • RTelier

        Because even though he doesn’t want you, YOU’VE still got your cool!

        That’s the thing about women like you, you’re so arrogant with confidence through the roof, you’ve always got your cool. I won’t be satisfied until you’re so broken down that you’re begging for him. Look what it feels like.

      • Nahida

        Why on earth would I ever beg for his affection if he is unwilling?

        I should allow my own need for it to destroy me before I coerce him!

        How can there be so much that you don’t know?

      • Nahida

        Look, RTelier, because the hour is so late I’ve just felt a strange sort of despair rise within me bringing me dangerously to the brink of tears–are you happy now? You’ve grown progressively crueler and I’ve no idea what I’ve done–except to practice my rights to refuse as I deserve! I will not surrender them to you; I truly owe you nothing and neither do “women like me.”

        I wish you’d realize that if you just shut up your work would do itself!

      • RTelier

        Eh, fine close enough. I guess knowing you’ll force yourself to suffer in silence even if it kills you before you ever ask him for anything is way better. Maybe from now on you’ll treat men more kindly and stop rejecting them.

      • Nahida

        I will never stop practicing my right to reject whom I please.

        I will be especially callous now thanks to you.

      • Olly

        RTelier, you have NO IDEA how NOBLE and MERCIFUL Nahida has been with you.

        She won’t tell you, but I will.

        When you contacted her two months ago, did you realize that even though you used an anonymous IP you were stupid enough to leave your work email address? Do you realize how easily she can contact your superiors and let them know you’ve been sexually harassing her while you should have been working?

        You have NO IDEA how noble she is.

      • Nahida

        Olly, no. Why would you tell him that? Why? It’s cruel… and tasteless… to rub into someone’s face that you haven’t done them in when you could have. Even if they’re driving you insane and the empty threat is tempting.

        Oh, oh and now it’s done. Steve will never trust me if he knows I could think of such a thing. It’s best anyway, since it is the truth–I would have wronged him greatly had he been mistaken, given me something under a faulty impression. I see now what I wouldn’t have deserved.

        I can’t stand stay awake with myself at this point, can’t think straight; I’m going to bed.

  59. Nahida

    Lately I haven’t been able to filter myself, and I wonder now if Steve is at last disillusioned and sees the truth; it’s so difficult to lie yet so easy to deceive. I do wish I had a hold of myself again though. What was it that unraveled me? Maybe I fully express myself impulsively because I have the idea that it will justify the fact that I am alive. I am afraid my own values are merely dreams, conjured up in a fervid moment of wistful thinking.

    Perhaps I have tried to preemptively circumvent transitory and meaningless relationships so impetuously that I have become transitory and meaningless. Perhaps I always was.

    As weary as I am of RTelier’s absurd efforts (I can only get so mean) the irritation results not only from his rude interruptions but from lack of necessity for them; he is right, after all, I sound increasingly pathetic–I can just keep talking and be wanted less and less.

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